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View Full Version : What if no Dreamliner ever?


chornedsnorkack
22nd Dec 2005, 14:17
Airlines are all assuming that they are getting Boeing 787-s in 2008 and new models in 2010 and later. They call it a new revolutionary technology. They have orders for it.

There is no part of Boeing 787 in existence now. The plane is supposed to make a first flight in 2007. The making of the first frame is supposed to start in 2006.

What would happen if no Boeing 787 ever flew?

Once upon a time there was a new, revolutionary plane Boeing 2707. Airlines held, I think, 122 orders. And the assembly of the first flying frame had actually started - more than can be said of Boeing 787 now.

No Boeing 2707 was ever rolled out. The first plane was not completed.

What happened to airlines who had ordered Boeing 2707 but did not get them?

What would happen if, sometime in 2006, something were discovered so that no Dreamliner is ever rolled out? What would become of the airlines?

TopBunk
22nd Dec 2005, 14:25
Airlines would buy other aircraft / use existing ones for longer --- what do you think? Aviation will suddenly stop? Silly question to be honest....

davedek
22nd Dec 2005, 15:13
I dont think its fair to cut him down like that, its a perfectly sensible question...

Indeed, airlines would carry on with existing aircraft and order new ones, but more importantly it would be a disaster for Boeing and heaven for airbus.

Tho I think it is unlikely it will ever happen... but you never know...

Technically there's also a chance that the A380 could never make a commerical flight.... :\

Avman
22nd Dec 2005, 18:33
They'll all order the new EMB-333 widebody!

TopBunk
22nd Dec 2005, 18:59
davedek

What makes it a sensible question? Why didn't he answer his own question, after all he asked about the B2707, a bit more research would have given him the answer about what happened to the airlines that ordered it.

Sorry (not really) to disagree, but dumb question.

barit1
25th Dec 2005, 23:00
I had the same reaction as TopBunk. The politicians were funding the 2707 (meaning, of course, the US taxpayer...), and the politicians shut off the project. I doubt Boeing (as a company) suffered, although MANY employees did.

Rainboe
26th Dec 2005, 08:32
Quite agree- very vacuous question. The 787 will be a great success when it is introduced, but if the whole program vanished off the face of the Earth, would any tears be shed? The vacuum would be filled. The market dictates what the airlines want, and the manufacturers supply what the airlines need. What more needs be said? Not only vacuous, but daft.

FCS Explorer
26th Dec 2005, 09:35
sure aviation would continue without.

i will build an aircraft that will safe 25% fuel and will fly faster and further. i will do the trick by simply using *modern* materials and engines


so, will anybody order some? i'm as far as boeing.

kooyheier
26th Dec 2005, 11:10
The 787 will be a great success when it is introduced

Bit of a Daft statement if you ask me... How do you know this?? Only time will tell in this case... We will not know until this a/c is actually in service... And yes maybe there are quite a few orders already for it, but again only time wil tell if this a/c is going to be a succes!!! Maybe you can have another look in your cristal ball and tell me who's going to win the World Cup next year;)

Cheerio:cool:

whattimedoweland
26th Dec 2005, 11:30
England 2-1 Germany:ok:

WTDWL.

Rainboe
26th Dec 2005, 12:25
What is 'success' then? If the aeroplane sells lots, and the program brings the manufacturer a profit, then that is 'success'! Boeing knows what it is doing- it can calculate the anticipated extra efficiency, not quite achieve it, run a program efficiency drive to improve it and get there, and sell lots to airlines that don't want ancient 767s and bigger 777s. How can it fail? It has original ideas. If the program gets cancelled, Airbus will ramp up production of the 350 kidding everyone they are getting something new and selling lots.
Mind you- the latest pictures of the 787 are losing that 'Batplane' look and becoming a tad more conventional, and there is talk the exciting new design ideas are backing off, but the weight saving from modern materials plus modern design efficiencies mean it will be a lot more fuel efficient, it will sell lots (as it is), and it will be a success. Hardly a stab in the dark, is it?

And England won't win. Overpaid nightclub addicts/Ferrari/Porsche drivers with limited football ability. Some of them can't even take penalties for goodness sake! How can a World Cup team field players who flunk like that guy did on a World Cup penalty shootout, and kick other players whilst lying on the ground? Shoddy!

chornedsnorkack
27th Dec 2005, 09:14
Technically there's also a chance that the A380 could never make a commerical flight....
Indeed. Several A380 frames have made test flights, which B787 and B2707 have not - but Bristol Brabazon also has, and Brabazon has never made a commercial flight. First test flight does not assure entry into service...

The 787 will be a great success when it is introduced, but if the whole program vanished off the face of the Earth, would any tears be shed? The vacuum would be filled. The market dictates what the airlines want, and the manufacturers supply what the airlines need.

The airlines, in 1960-s, seem to have wanted (needed?) planes which could cross the Atlantic in 3 hours with 300 passengers 7 abreast, at a reasonable price. Boeing tried to supply it - and failed. No one filled the vacuum. The vacuum is still there. Aerospatiale eventually came up with a plane that could cross the Atlantic in 4 hours with just 100 passengers at a huge price. No one else got even this far... Tupolev, IIRC, never had the range nor reliability to cross the pond.

How can it fail? It has original ideas.
Didnīt B2707 have any original ideas?

ETOPS
27th Dec 2005, 11:18
There is no part of Boeing 787 in existence now

So what is this ?


http://www.netcomposites.com/images/boeing787nose_0805.jpg

chornedsnorkack
28th Dec 2005, 07:11
Is the nose in the picture supposed to be incorporated in a complete flying frame?

MarkD
28th Dec 2005, 13:16
There will be a 787 - Boeing has gone too far down the tracks. However, the carbon fibre fuselage does worry me, especially in the light of the Alaskan MD-80 (ground vehicle hits a/c, driver doesn't own up) since damage to CF is so much harder to detect.