F-35 decision dooms RAF Leeming

[Styron]

F-35 decision dooms RAF Leeming
Simon McGee
Political Editor

A YORKSHIRE RAF base is set to close after failing to become the host for a future generation of RAF fighter planes, sparking concerns about "huge knock-on effects" for the local economy.

Armed Forces Minister Adam Ingram announced yesterday that he could not guarantee the future of RAF Leeming, near Northallerton, once the base's current Tornados are phased out – although he signalled other roles were being considered.

Leeming had been one of five air military airports nationally being considered for the new F-35 Joint Strike Fighter which is still in development but, ultimately, a Scottish base was named.

The MoD said the noise impact would be disproportionate for residents in nearby towns and villages including Bedale and Aiskew where local people had expressed fears about the new aircraft.

Last night politicians in the county said there was a good chance the facility could be given over to the Army garrison at Catterick, securing vital cash for the local economy and perhaps even safeguarding the 100 or so local jobs at the base, currently home to 1,800 military and civilian personal.

MP Anne McIntosh said: "It's effectively the end of RAF Leeming.

"And there's no guarantee whatsoever that they'll find another use for the airbase.

"We need to know sooner rather than later what's really happening, to work out the implications for the local economy."

North Yorkshire County Council had stated that it recognised the importance of Leeming to the local economy but had "serious reservations" about its suitability.

Replying to a question by the Tory defence spokesman Julian Lewis about RAF Leeming, Mr Ingram said: "There are a number of work things in place that could have a very beneficial outcome for Leeming, but they're not at a mature level yet.

"We'll just have to wait and see how they play out."

North Yorkshire County Council leader John Weighell was hopeful last night that Leeming would still have a military future.

"An announcement will be made in Catterick soon that may well see the Army taking the base over," he said.

"We guessed that the sound problem for the sheer number of people living nearby would make it difficult for the new plane to be based there, but we still want it to be kept as an MoD base."

At a press conference at RAF Lossiemouth, Group Captain Russ Torbet, Station Commander at RAF Lossiemouth and Group Captain Chris Birks, Station Commander at RAF Kinloss, said the announcement secured the future of both bases for the next 30 years.

Group Captain Torbet said: "This is excellent news for the station and the local community and will ensure an RAF presence for many years to come."

[Safety_Helmut]

"We guessed that the sound problem for the sheer number of people living nearby would make it difficult for the new plane to be based there, but we still want it to be kept as an MoD base."

So, they wanted to have their cake and to eat it !

Safety_Helmut

[Styron]

Sadly there's very little RAF presence betwen Edinburgh and Lincoln now.

I am sure it will lower the RAF's profile even further in the north of England, and generate less local identification with the service.

Number of proper RAF bases now in the whole of northern England now, one, Linton on Ouse near York.

If the RAF doesn't care about the north, perhaps it's time than people in the north stopped joining and perhaps it's also time to stop the RAF using areas of outstanding natural beauty for low flying, given that this contributes nothing to the regions, whilst all the bases are in Scotland or East Anglia.

[PTT]

given that this contributes nothing to the regions
Apart from the usual roles the military carries out, you mean?

[Styron]

The usual roles, don't make me laugh.

They fly over the north at high speed, less they catch something off the common population.

Perhaps they can test the next generation anti-chav missile up here, as they clearly don't like the place. :)

Or they can launch low level chav sorties, 'burberry at 2,000 feet' :O

Still makes me feel secure that there is little in the way of RAF bases now between Edinburgh and Lincoln :}

[Twonston Pickle]

Quite frankly, these locals deserve to have the base whipped out from underneath them. They can then smuggly watch their economy dissappear before their very eyes and all the local amenities close, resulting in further travel for basic needs.

[VigilantPilot]

Are you seriously trying to say that the RAF doesn't have a presence in the north because it doesn't like northerners?!

Its unfortunate that RAF Leeming may no longer be secure, but I suspect the noise factor, plus the fact that the real estate is worth more than Lossie is the major factor.

Its an unfortunate situation, but the armed forces do not deploy for a particular region, but the country as a whole, therefore you cant say that the RAF doesn't care about the north.

[BEagle]

"......whilst all the bases are in Scotland or East Anglia."

Which 'bases in East Anglia' would those be, then?

Marham and, err..............

Coltishall, Duxford, Feltwell, Honington, Martlesham Heath, North Weald, Oakington, Stradishall, Waterbeach, Wattisham, Watton, West Raynham?

Which other one(s) did you mean?

Join the RAF, work your gonads off through IOT, EFT and BFTS...and then it's Valley and Jockistan. That should really encourage folks to go the FJ route.

Or else it's the ME route to Brize or Waddo and err, well, that's about it if the idiots do close Lyneham. Or the corgi-carriers at Northolt. Or Jockistan again...

Or go RW and enjoy Benson and, for the time being at least, Odiham?

[Tim Inder]

Well, Beags, you could sign up as a FC and go to Neatis- oh, scratch that too :(

[Zoom]

Back in the relatively low-tech 80s MOD was 'rusticating' like mad - shifting various departments from London into the countryside mainly to keep the costs down. Is that still happening to any degree or is MOD still cluttering up Central London? In these high-tech noughties there seems to be litttle point in keeping any MOD departments at all in London, particularly as 'briefing the minister' can easily be done by phone/tv/video/internet or whatever. So 100,000 MOD jobs (Civil Sevice and military) could be spread about the UK and would make sensible use of acres of established office buildings with on-site accommodation and plenty of parking space. And it would still be quiet enough for the locals. And it would help Red Ken in is aim of making London a traffic-free zone.

[mystic_meg]

Zoom, my dear chap, there is no room in today's political environment for such clear-cut thinking as yours...take yourself outside and have a word with yourself would you? What on earth were you thinking of?

[Tamaze Man]

Styron,

I love the North and would happily be based anywhere from North of Birmingham and South of Edinburgh! (Not that I don't like Scotland before I offend anyone). we must keep people from the North interested and make sure they continue to join up! How else will the Forces survive if it is only manned by 'shandy drinking southerners!'.:ok:

[Roland Pulfrew]

Zoom

Dear chap where are there 100,000 MOD military and civil serpant staff? The refurbished MOD holds about 3300 military and civilian staff. Most of the rest of the military and MOD civil serpents have been moved out of London already. Just why should a department of state be relocated to anywhere other than the capital along with all of the other departments of state?

Anyone who still thinks there are thousands of personnel in MOD HQ hasn't been there and did not go through the drawdown process prior to the move back into MB. And anyone who thinks the MOD HQ is overstaffed hasn't worked there!

And anyway London is a great place to work if you have to do a ground tour, so why would we want to move out to Brizzle and the like? ;) :D

[BEagle]

Is there anywhere between Birmingham and Edinburgh?

The only thing really wrong about Jockistan is the FNM territory between the the Humber and the Tweed.

:p

[Safety_Helmut]

So 100,000 MOD jobs (Civil Sevice and military) could be spread about the UK and would make sensible use of acres of established office buildings with on-site accommodation and plenty of parking space.
Sorry Zoom, the entire DPA and DLO is being relocated into the shiney Gin Palace in Bristol. Precisely where there is not enough office space and bugger all parking space !

Safety_Helmut

[BEagle]

Which probably means that DPA and DLO are far too big?

Or are there just too many civil serpents infesting the Brizzle Waterworld?

Only went there once - it reminded me of that future city in the movie Logan's Run. Kept hoping to run into Jenny Agutter getting her kit off.....

[caspertheghost]

Beagle,
FNM???

[BEagle]

A clue:

LS&2SB

[caspertheghost]

All becomes clear!

[Styron]

Which 'bases in East Anglia' would those be, then?

Alright then, East Anglia, Lincolnshire and around that area.

Bases being Marham, Cottesmore, Wittering, Coningsby, Cranwelll, Digby, Waddington, Scampton, Honnington, Wyton, Brampton and other bases with RAF Units such as Chicksands.

There you are, the North is just for flying over and dropping stuff on.

First Boulmer goes, now Leeming, Church Fenton is merely a relief landing ground and I wouldn't be suprised if they close Linton on Ouse.

[BEagle]

So, apart from the roads......

[Styron]

The RAF's Northern England Command

http://www.warbird-photos.com/britishairpower03/images/pict8290.jpg

[Pontius Navigator]

And between Birmingham and Edinburgh we have that amazing SAM belt at Spade!

[Styron]

Perhaps when Leeming closes the RAF can lower the flag and play the last post in order to indicate there final withdrawl from the North of England (that inhospitable area of Empire with it's Burberry clad natives and their strange dialects) :)

[Safety_Helmut]

There you are, the North is just for flying over and dropping stuff on.
Styron. that's not strictly true. The north is also good for the storage of nuclear waste and the siting of most of our petrochemical industry.

Safety_Helmut

[Styron]

Oh I forgot about Nuclear Waste, Petro-chemicals, Cotton Mills, Gracie Fields and Newcastle Brown Ale :p


Bloody RAF, I am away to walk me whippet.

[MarkD]

Makes me wonder - if Scotland ever voted for independence the RAF would find itself in a bit of a pickle, essentially operating a huge amount of its ops on foreign soil. Then there's the Navy and Trident...

[An Teallach]

a huge amount of its ops on foreign soil.

How so? Presumably if God's Own Country dissolved the union, 10% of the RAF would become the SAF or RSAF depending on whether we wished to keep the monarchy.

Chances are we would want to be shot of Trident anyway, though if the more canny Scottish Tories ever recover enough to happen to form a Scottish Govt, we could continue to operate Trident or lease the base for an exorbitant sum to our NIMBY southern neighbours. ;)

[MarkD]

An Teallach

didn't reckon the SNP to be the warlike sort :D That said, the Parti Quebecois have just come round to having an army "when the day comes" so I suppose it's possible.

However, infantry will seem so much more like a job scheme than FJs I suspect a Soviet Republic of Scotland Air Force will look much like, er, the Irish Air Corps - couple of hundred lads, a few trainers and a couple of BJs for the pols...

[BEagle]

"......couple of BJs for the pols..."

Bill Clinton?

[serf]

Nice photo of BEagle

[RileyDove]

Give the Irish Air Corps their dues! Those Pilatus PC-21's do look the business !

[pr00ne]

Thought Leeming is where all you SH types are going to go when they close Odiham and Benson?

[BEagle]

No - they'll probably re-open Machrihanish for them......

[GeeRam]

The RAF's Northern England Command


http://www.warbird-photos.com/britishairpower03/images/pict8290.jpg




Hmmm.....more like RAF's Southern California Command, at 'RAF Chino'.....:ugh::uhoh:

[pr00ne]

What's the crew room gossip on the fate of Cottesmore then?
Surely it has had a bit spent on it to cater for JFH?

SH base instead of or as well as Leeming?

Isn't it a bit far south for the newly restructured "join up and see Scotland" RAF?

[arthurwellington]

BEagle

Machrihanish; surely nobody would entertain such a cunning plan.

My mistake, it was considered as an option for SH, AAvn et al.................:8

[serf]

............and would make a perfect base for CQWI and TLT.

[Biggus]

What does the RN have between Lincoln and Edinburgh? Does that mean they don't recruit anyone from that region - somehow I doubt it!!!

[Roland Pulfrew]

Biggus

Yorkshire URNU (in 'ull) and Northumbrian(?) URNU each with a P2000 and a base. And isn't there an RNR base on the Tyne? Not much I know but it is something ;)

[ORAC]

HMS Calliope (http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/static/pages/2481.html)

RMR Tyne (http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/static/pages/2822.html)

[Biggus]

Mine was a genuine question, as I didn't know what the RN has left in the north, although I assumed it wasn't a lot! I'm glad there is still some RN presence there - but it appears to indeed be minimal, and I don't think it invalidates my point that I am sure the RN still obtain many recruits from that part of the world - despite having a small local 'footprint'!!

[CBA_caption]

Apparently the H and S looneys have put an end to mach campletown because, according to their review it would kill too many people on the roads travelling there. Hence OPEVAL at St Mawgan.

I assume thats why the Americans always fly in. Heaven forbid we should do anything dangerous! Bl00dy h€ll! Why don't you tell my mate killed in a roadside bomb in Basra its more dangerous to drive to the west coast of Scotland.

CBA:mad:

[Styron]

What does the RN have between Lincoln and Edinburgh? Does that mean they don't recruit anyone from that region - somehow I doubt it!!!

Warships are built on the Tyne, reguarly visit the Tyne and there is a strong bond with the Navy on Tyneside and in many areas of the North.

There will also be no RAuxAF in the North once Leeming has gone,
so the RAF will not have the advantage of a TA type force or a
RNR in the North.

The only real bonds the RAF had, were Boulmer and Leeming, there closure will mean very little local news regarding the RAF and a much lower profile for the RAF in the North and there will now be very little chance of any kind of posting in the North of England which might not please some northerners.

The RAF in my opinion is becoming more and more isolated from the very communities it seeks to recruit from, and if kids don't want to join in the future they only have themselves to blame.

[Tegan]

Styron,

I'm totally with you on this. I'm from the north myself and didn't join the RN deliberately as I didn't want to spend my life down in the south. Now 4 years later and look where the RAF's going? Lincolnshire! To be perfectly honest civvy streets beginning to look a lot more favourable. At least with people like NATS you've got the opportunity to escape RAF Lincolnshire - land of the flat. Either that or I hear the RAAF are recruiting!

[sarmonkey]

I thought you were turned away by the the RN because you passed the intelligence test?

[soddim]

RAF Lincolnshire - land of the flat

Not true - most people in Lincolnshire live in houses and half the county is Tennison's Wolds - obviously Tegan needs to visit the County!