Morale - Discuss!

[Barn Doors]

I think its clear to all that low morale and disaffection is rife in the services at the moment. Maybe if we posted how bad it actually is (without exaggeration), any top brass 'surfing' this site may wake up and smell the coffee. Then again, pigs might fly (no pun intended to the AAC!)

Go on, post away and lets find out.....

[Sumo Boy]

Actually mate, to be honest, I am happy as Fu*ck! :ok:

[Stitchbitch]

Good for you, but I know lots of engineers that are voting with thier feet and getting the hell out of dodge. Me? I will stay as long as possible,you never know,we might just get our pay upgraded (then again Pigs do fly...) :E and besides,some one has to take the piss out of you when you try 'the hoffman box with the daylight filters on' trick!'

[Blacksheep]

In decline since sixty-nine. I'm surprised there's anybody left... :)

If you can't take a joke, you shouldn't have joined.

[The Rocket]

Blacksheep,

Is a day out of blue also a day wasted:yuk: :yuk: :yuk:

[ORAC]

If you can't take a joke, you shouldn't have joined.

Now updated to, "if you can't take it, you shouldn't have joined a joke".......:hmm:

[BEagle]

Sumo, when you return from swanning about on the Tokyo embassy cocktail party circuit and have to join the real world, it'll be interesting to see how you feel then......

[Widger]

Morale - Discuss!


Discuss it yourself!

[southside]

low morale and disaffection is rife in the services

please delete the word services and insert the words Royal Air Force and (possibly) Army.

Morale in the RN is soaring. Certainly in my fleet life is good. The weather is fab, all the aircraft are serviceable, the tasking is fun, we get paid lots, have every weekend off, now working the "core working week" which is bloody ace and has made a vast improvement to our working lives.

So, NO Mr gloom and Doom. Morale is not low in the Senior Service. If Morale is low in your Service then maybe you should ask yourself why it is low and what YOU could do to improve morale. Rather than sitting back and moaning about it and expecting someone else to do something, how about YOU do something.

[Role1a]

SS

What is the core working week?

[southside]

the Core Working week is as follows:

You have to work 32 Hours a week. Of those 32 Hour, 24 Hours are compulsory. Those 24 Hours are as follows:

Monday 1300 - 1600
Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday 0800-1200 and 1300 -1600


That make 8 hours to make up. When you work those 8 hours are up to you. You can work Fridayss or Monday mornings, or if you night fly on Monday night that counts as well. Most people tend to work an extra couple of hours during the week which gives them Fridays off.

Best routine since sliced bread. Thank you very much Fleet .

[Role1a]

Very nice

How does it work for Navy SAR, Deployed ops and sea time?

R1a

[Roland Pulfrew]

SS

Surely this is no change. I have never met anyone from the dark blue who hasn't worked this way for years! ;)

[southside]

No, but now its official.

It doesn't work at sea as you are on standby and liable for flying 24/7.

But ashore, its fab.

[The Gorilla]

Yes but then the Navy doesn't actually do anything does it? I mean almost all the ships are tied up in port with awaiting the scrap heap or are short of essential spares. And you don't see anything in the news about Naval ops do you??



:}

[Bob Viking]

It does annoy me when people say that morale is so low with such a sweeping generality.
Where I work, things are pretty good. For once, I actually agree with a Navy person (won't make a habit of it I promise). I
think Barn Door should have a look around his own section and see what the problem is before saying we're all unhappy.
I accept that some people have it harder than others but please don't tar us with the same brush!
BV

[raytofclimb]

Your 'core week' sounds exactly like the type of office mentality that means you can't get any admin done between your two flights per day. All the blunties are on either a pre-work tea break, mid-morning coffee-and-chat, hour-and-a-half lunch break, or stress-avoiding-pre-knock-off-biscuit break.

It might work in the Navy in general, or in administrative circles but not on a front line sqn.

I don't get a "lunch break". I shove some dry rations or a pot noodle in my face between de-brief from the morning sortie and planning/brief for the afternoon's. 40 hour week? I wish. Most people I know bounce off one crew duty limit to the next, often with the bare legal minimum time not with their feet over the sqn threshold. And we're not even on Ops!

When I finish at 1730 all the support staff from the station have legged it.

Good for you if you can get it. Maybe I'm in the wrong colour!

Ray

[southside]

But thats the point Ray......thats why you lot are all pi$$ed off and morale is low and thats why in the RN morale is (generally) high....and that is on top of TRAF200, an event designed to cause as much disruption and disgruntleness as possible - Yep, despite TRAF200 life in a blue suit is generally top banana (apart from the fact that trappers are coming in a few weeks)

If your daily routine is that bad then change it.

[JNo]

If it's so great then why is the RN PVR rate over 50% higher ( http://www.dasa.mod.uk ) than the airforce???? Must be brilliant be dark blue!

[Duncan Bucket]

Not only is southside pitching up for his core working week and I suspect little else, he is using his work time to post on and, one presumes, surf pprune. No wonder morale is so high.

I wish I had his job (except having to fly Lynx of course):E

[Vim_Fuego]

I think it's pretty much 'horses for courses' as far as how happy or not you are...If you joined the light blues some 20 years ago(as i did) you may have some reason to feel sad at the decline in numbers and 'how things used to be'. If you have joined recently you would'nt know any different as far as workload and deployments go...

As it happens I am not particuarly low in the morale stakes but I did share a few beers with some groundcrew off multiple platforms (it was a stag) and I could barely move my feet for the pile of iron filings around them...ie they had so many axes to grind!

I agree with a lot of the sentiments on this thread...not all are unhappy but then not all are getting shafted or the shafting is of various lengths and frequency...ohh! I have had to learn to put up, shut up and smile:hmm:

Best wishes Vim

[iccarus]

Unfortunately, its human nature to try and do your best. Its also forces nature to have the 'can-do" attitude and achieve the maximum at all times. These two little traits are a major cause of most the problems we have. We constantly try to achieve the unachievable without the right resources. And surprisingly, we often manage to get the job done. But at the expense of 'burnt out crews' , the loss of a lot of good will, and hence crap morale!!Additionally, no- one is prepared to stand up and be counted and say -- STOP. With the assetts and crews we have we just can't achieve what you are asking. (For one it would adversely effect their future career!)

What does this mean on my frontline?

Well it has meant at times, 8 back to back working weekends, (and before you ask, the boys were also doing the obligatory mon - fri at i estimate to be minimum of 12 hour days). And all this during normal peacetime ops!!

I'd love to do the whole officer thing and provide solutions rather than problems , but the truth is i can't think of any.

Its simple - there is no money, and the service is relying solely on the good will of its men and women to survive. And then it wonders why the guys and gals leave at the earliest opportunity!

Perhaps, and this is at a push, we should consider some sort of union to push for the rights of the people who defend their country. ( European court of law might actually help us in achieving this for once).

Saw it work wonders with the Danish Air Force!!!(or is that another thread?)

[monkeybumhead]

How about "Morale, you find it".

I can tell you that morale in my place of work is about as low as a lean implementing OC Eng (things don't get much lower, not even snakes ar$e$).:{ :{ :{

[Talking Radalt]

Remember the scene in The Great Escape where Steve McQueen sits in his cell , after toiling against the odds for weeks on end making do with what's on offer or what can be scrounged in order to achieve the seemingly impossible, only to be banged up again, and thus relentlessly bounces his baseball off the opposite wall ?

That's me that is. Or at least it feel like it some times. Actually that's bollox, what I meant is it feels like it ALL the time. :(

[southside]

I think what you lot need to do is to go and find an Officer. An Officer will be able to lift your morale. He will have the neccesary leadership skills. The Officer will be enthusiastic, bright, cheerful. he will lead you and encourage you. he will build your confidence and develop your pride in your service but most of all your pride in yourself.

So, if your morale is low then I suggest you go and talk to an Officer. he'll sort it for you.

[Safety_Helmut]

So, if your morale is low then I suggest you go and talk to an Officer. he'll sort it for you.

south side, tell us you are joking please, becuase the tone of your posts has made most of us think you are serious !

Ever been measured up for a room with rubber wallpaper ?

Safety_Helmut

[Green Flash]

An aid to morale, especially when deployed .......:}

http://www.airquee.co.uk/pub/

[Logistics Loader]

Quality boost to morale !!

Grapevine is they looking to release inflatable aircraft too...!!!
But relised aircraft already have enough hot air inside :ok:

[dolphinops]

Remember:

"Rise above the rest"

:E

[bird99]

I just want to work for an organisation where you work 14-16 hrs a day average (and some/most weekends) and do a pretty good job and then after 6 years you're in with a chance of getting promoted (or - more recent aspiration - going to work somewhere where you can work 8-5 and who gives a stuff than about getting promoted...). Unfortunately I joined the RAF. B***er. Actually I'd happily work 20 hours a day if one person ever said thank you or something resembling a remotely pleasant comment (and, yes, I do practice what I preach with my troops). Yes I get the lovely glowing OJAR every year but that doesn't count for anything.

[Triple Matched TQ]

Yes Morale is soaring - Most jobs are now civilianised (therefore you have to do the work yourself), Lean has made everyones life much easier (with its sensible. level headed ideas), Common core working week (means I get to go home on a Thursday now).

With hardly any forms to fill in - it now leaves plently of time to sit around and drink coffee, or maybe even fly one of the many serviceable aircraft (lots of spares around).

Life is great :ok: = I wouldn't have it any other way.

[Thud_and_Blunder]

Wasn't there once a guardroom poster that went along the following lines?:

"Actions on discovery of an Outbreak of Morale:

- Shout MORALE, MORALE, MORALE

- Make one attempt to put it out

- Fetch the Leading Regulator/ RP Sgt (RSMs Dog)/ SWO Pig"

[Wyler]

FTRS, its the way ahead! The RAF gets my experience (and continuity) and I ditch most of the b******t. I get to come to the factory every day (I do actually love my job!), play with the toys and go home. I still get deployed but I have stability at home, where it counts. My wife gets to keep a job for more than 2 years and my kids have made long term friends and are settled in school. No 6000's, no sec duties and little hassle.
Also, as I am here long term, I can officially welcome the army of civil servants who seem to be taking over the running of the RAF.
We now actually have TWO admin squadrons here that are led(?) and run by Civil Servants. Needless to say, one is a management perfomance sqn! Perhaps this should be another thread.....

[rivets]

Eh? when did the dark blue work fridays? all the skimmers I worked with went home on Friday lunchtime and turned up again Monday lunchtime, trains permitting.:ok:

[ORAC]

Are British troops at breaking point in Iraq? (http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article320343.ece) :*

Sometimes we are our own worst enemies. Talk about aid and comfort to the enemy. Just one more push lads, see, we´ve got them cracking......... :suspect:

[TacEval Inject]

Trust me on this one, it's not just the troops at breaking point. The rotary guys are working themselves to the bone to support BLiar et al. There is nothing better than having over 1/3 of a sqn away at any one time, only to find that some/most of the support elements of the military struggle to do the simplest of jobs (ie support the deployed lads and lasses). It is rather a shame that the work ethic that I have come to learn and love at my place is not echoed around the non-formed unit peeps.

Those out there can figure out that with that many away, the roulements come round rather too quickly. I'm fully awaiting Southside to poke his head above the parapet and offer some words of wisdom, but for his sake, I recommend he keeps hunkered down.

TI out

[tonkatechie]

My morale isn't low - the work's hard, the hours can be very long, the management make decisions that baffle me, and I get sent away to places I'd rather not go to. However, I and my collegues do our utmost everyday to take the p*ss out of all of these things and it makes us happy!
Quite often people say "Your Squadron is crap", but to me the Squadron is the people I work with, not the management, the aircraft or the jobs we do - so if it's crap that's me you're calling crap, and I'll knock your teeth out for saying it! I'm a professional, and I insist that my lads (and lasses) are too, but we're going to have a laugh while we're at it!
The grass is always greener in civvy street, but I still reckon I'm on to a good thing here...

[enginesuck]

just gotta stay in for another 14 years so i can finally say i was in baghdad when you were in your dads bag.......:yuk:

[southside]

2 Points to make.


The rotary guys are working themselves to the bone to support BLiar et al. That'll be their job then. Thats what they are there for.


Good points made by tonkie ...although I'd argue that the grass isn't always greener. I know of 2 Ex- airline pilots who have returned to the fold because they wanted more stability and more weekends off !!!! At least in the Military flying world, once you have established yourself in an aircraft you can be almost certain where you will live, in the airlines it isn't always the same.

[sarmonkey]

SS

That'll be their job then. Thats what they are there for.

Yes, and that's the curse, I suppose, of having a job and an ability to be exploited by our overstretching masters. If we were of minimal use to anyone we could take Monday mornings off and have a set lunch hour. At least having that routine allows you to comment with authority on what it's like as a civvy.

[MG]

Yes, SS, you're right, that is my job. I love my job, honestly, but it does get wearing when I'm ALWAYS away and can't plan fun things at the weekend as I know I'm probably going to have to cancel them. I honestly envy you that you can work such gentlemanly hours but please don't presume that we're all able to do that, because we simply can't. Thanks to our Glorious Leader, we are doing more and more each year. We are limited in our RW resources and when the army go anywhere or there is a humanitarian need (Which I fully support, incidentally) off we go for another month or 2! It's not just the going away, it's generally the short notice of it and the uncertainty of when you're returning. In short, life is unstable and you can't keep that up ad infinitum.
SS, I really think you're living on another planet and are really quite Jack if you think we can change our destiny. We are underfunded, thanks to the Great JHC and too useful. And yes, I too want to be Jack and go to some other job within the RAF as, sad as it may seem, the RAF is my life. Sadly, I fear that I'm too useful to the RW world for the poster (appointer) to let me go. That leaves me with the PVR option. I really do not want to leave but I can see the day coming if only to retain my sanity and my marriage. The Forces are not worth the loss of either of those!

[TacEval Inject]

I knew it. Southside just could not keep away from the keyboard, could he. SH bases are the places where you leave your life at the minute, not where you live. And it's the RW guys jobs to get dicked about is it?

Really, I though more of you SS.

We try our best to keep morale up, but certain idiots try their damndest to break it down. I'll mention no names.

TI

[southside]

So hang on. You join the military but then moan and complain when you are sent overseas to serve your Country ? No, no. Your right. I bet there wasn't many of you saw that one coming was there? What ever next eh? No doubt they will expect you to wear a uniform next eh? maybe expect you to die as well . Now that would never do would it?

[Almost_done]

Dear SS,

What is the weather like in your part of the world, humm, rose coloured clouds, birds chirping away in the hedgerows?

Blimey!

Get into the real life now and see what operations the troops in the RAF are supporting, see where we are being deployed and what units/squadrons are taking the brunt of the movements.

We do not have the luxury of the 110K size RAF anymore, or didn't you realise that? Thanks to many downsizing opportunities we are now heading to 41k. Surprisingly not of these personnel are either aircrew, technicians or Admin types. But this figure takes in ALL of the Serving personnel from CAS to the lowest Airman. including personnel who from no fault of their own are medically downgraded.

Take these personnel from the active list and that 41K reduces, so the 'fit' personnel are left shouldering the burden. How many Staff officers are flying or servicing A/C in Basra, kandahar or even in the falklands? Add this then that figure reduces even further.

Yes we ALL joined up and we knew the risks, hell I bet if you ask most of the current serving personnel if they have ever asked to go on operational tours I bet (1 doctor excluding) most will say yes, they knew (I know) the risks, willing to put their lifes on the line for their comrades, country and Queen.

The problem is that we are being asked to do more and more with less and less. if you wish to look up out of your half full pint pot you will see a Modern Fighting Force about to be brought down onto it's knees very soon.

The only time you will complain about what we are doing is when we are no longer able to do so, by then it will be too late, the ethos, moral and the experiance will have walked out through the door.

Then you will moan.

'If only we had listened to the people that were currently serving in the RAF we may have had one now!'

Act in haste repent in lesuire, is the motto of the day I feel.

/Rant off

[southside]

Thankgoodness for that. Your the first serving Officer on here to acknowledge that. Well done. Lets hope the rest of them can also see that rather than moaning about it.

[Widger]

Well maybe you need a "head of Service" that has the balls to say "If you take these assets away... we cannot do this task or support this NATO role"

[southside]

Very true. Although I have to say, this is not new. Being over stretched is not new. Back in 1983 I did back to back FI deployments. 13 Months away from home with 2 weeks leave in the middle. Why ? Cos we were short of manpower.....Hmmmm come along way havent we.

[MG]

I completely agree with Widger; I do wish those bove us had enough about them to say 'Enough!'. The 'can do' attitude is all well and good but it should never be a cover for squeezing blood out of a stone every single time.
SS, I think I can see where you're coming from but your posts sounds as if you're sat smugly in an ivory tower. The fact is, unless I leave, which I dearly don't want to do, there is b~gger all I can do about it. At least some PoWs got repatriated for going mad; I'm more likely to be given a command if I do!!

[JessTheDog]

My morale is great! I go home every night, know that I won't get sent away at short notice, I have enough time to do my job and adequate resources, and I don't have to move house every few years.

I'm so glad I PVR'd!

[HOODED]

I'll second that Jess, though in my case I took redundancy. My mortgage is now paid I have a nice little pension and no more "They want AA tommorow you'll have to rob AB, we can rob it back tommorow night as AB's extension will be up if it does a sortie tommorow so it'll be out of hours!"

Now if I work lots of extra hours I get paid overtime, and I can say NO! If they wan't me to go to some sandpit they ask if I'd like to and offer me some incentive, not tell me I'm going tough!

God I miss it, well truth be told I miss some of the troops but most of the good uns left with me or were waiting for tranche 2 or 3 or PVR if no joy.

At least my morale is good now but I still feel sorry for those left trying to make it work.

Remember : - "We've being doing so much, for so long, with so little, that now they expect us to do everything with nothing!":ok:

[The Gorilla]

Jess and Hooded

I have nothing to add to your posts. I feel exactly the same way as you two do. I miss the people and remember only the good times.

I feel sorry for those we have left behind..

[Hammer Head Too]

Jess, Hooded, Gorilla.

Can't agree more. PVR'd this year...wrote a long (ish) "reasons" page which ended with the words......

'with redundancy in full swing and TG1 being profoundly targeted who will actually give a damn'

Who will ?? It is so sad to see this Service being gutted by the current situation and no-one willing or able to arrest the rot. Without the USA involved could we carry out a full campaign??

Morale??....for the doubters amongst you wait until tranche 3 is finished and see the PVR rate then.

HH2

[Navaleye]

Flogging will continue until morale improves :p


Actually mine is fine but the only uniforms I get to see these days are traffic wardens.