Female pilot quotas

[AviARTrix]

Can anyone tell me if a quota for female pilots exists in Air NZ? And, if it does exist, how does it work?

[Raw Data]

If it does exist, it should be challenged legally as the sexist piece of PC nonsense that it would be.

If a woman needs a quota system to help them get a job, she doesn't deserve it.

[Poto]

WHOOP WHOOP DIG UP:ouch:

[OZBUSDRIVER]

Always reckon it is so funny to see the ALP go on about quota for women in winnable seats and the coalition have more women elected into parliament on merit.

[BackdoorBandit]

Whats even funnier is that most airlines have the same policy as the ALP.:}

[Highbypasss]

What's even funnier than that is that no one has answered the original question yet!!!

...........................................H:cool:

[Pass-A-Frozo]

I'm surprised Helen Clark hasn't mandated one so she has something to look at when travelling :}

[pakeha-boy]

AviARTrix.......you will have stirred the Hornets nest with this one for sure....in this day and age,whether you like it or not...there will always be a quota....as long as there are lawyers ...there will be lawsuits....no company in their right mind would ever publically disclose this type of information, for obvious reasons.
A previous post stated that your original question has not been answered...I doubt it will ever be.....unless you are privy to the "upper crust" within the ranks of AirNZ,this info will/would be a closely kept secret....percentages will play a major roll in this #....the company who I fly for has 4000+ pilots,and let me tell you mate,there is a very broad spectrum of applicants....from Colour to Nationalities to Gender......this will no doubt lead to a heated debate...treat it as the norm,why....because it is......by the way I fly with many women pilots......dont have a problem....the same question could be asked....do they have quota,s for blacks/whites/Islander/Gay/pakeka-boy/weight/looks............look at the Flak United Airlines took over the years.....good luck with this one.......motunga

[Wizofoz]

a very broad spectrum of applicants....from Colour to Nationalities to Gender.

...To semi-literates it would appear!!

[pakeha-boy]

thats good Wizofoz.......very good........porangi

[chief wiggum]

Surely IF there is a quota system in place, and these companies are FORCED to hire substandard applicants from the minority group, then the SAFETY question would rear its ugly head?

What would happen when, heaven forbid, a pilot employed under a QUOTA is involved in a serious accident? The legal eagles would go through EVERY bit of paperwork involved in the pilots' employment, and it would come out that the pilot MAY have been substandard but pushed through because of the quota.

Each pilot should be employed on their individual merits, not because of some stupid quota system.

Pilot is an ASEXUAL word, without bias or gender or race differentiation!

[oicur12]

“Can anyone tell me if a quota for female pilots exists in Air NZ? And, if it does exist, how does it work”

In NZ, no idea. In Oz – not legal for a private company to do so although some companies may have policies to encourage a broader spectrum of applicants to join.

“….and these companies are FORCED to hire substandard applicants from the minority group”.

Perhaps you could name such a company but more importantly, when did women become minorities?

“What would happen when, heaven forbid, a pilot employed under a QUOTA is involved in a serious accident? The legal eagles would go through EVERY bit of paperwork involved in the pilots' employment, and it would come out that the pilot MAY have been substandard but pushed through because of the quota.”

Every airline has substandard employees on the books that are pushed through the system because of relatives/mates/jobs for the boys/squadron buddies or whatever. We have all flown with substandard MEN in various airlines that the “legal eagles” hopefully will not get a chance to have to deal with – there but the grace of god . . .

[Tutaewera]

Like previous posters said I don't think you'll ever get anyone to admit to it. But IMHO it has existed at various times.

I don't believe many people these days would begrudge any female pilot getting a job she has earned fairly, and I certainly have flown with and even been trained by some very competent female pilots. What we are talking about is the animosity resulting from those who have got something they didn't earn by virue of PC.

An example was in the late 1990's when Air NZ mainline (who hadn't recruited for years) finally did a round of interviews. Because of the lack of industry movement there were many highly qualified and experienced guys backed up in the regionals (Air Nsn, Mt Cook, Eagle etc). From memory there were about 22 interviewed for 20 jobs and of that 6 were females. Statistically you were many many times more likely to get an interview if you were female. Despite the fact that several of them came from the bottom end of the regionals and had less relevant experience, EFIS etc and quals than a large number of guys who couldn't get an interview, and that some of them had shall we say "dodgy" reps that would disqualify most guys - they all got the jobs.

It was fairly obvious to us at the time that something fishy was going on... Prior to leaving my NZ regional the Line Ops Mgr told me behind closed doors that yes there had been a "policy", however there were problems with some of them in TRN and one who allegedly planned to and then did get pregnant immediately after her line check. The brass had then apparently said "no more".

At another level - prior to that at her regional, one of the same group was given extra training and and eventually even a command against the recommendation of her (female) TRE / instructor - who told me she should have been "chopped". But was told by Mgt to put her through...

I don't know if it still goes on as I haven't been in NZ for a while but unofficially I believe it used to...

Still we don't make nor can we easily affect these decisions and so why get angry over it.



:uhoh:

[mattyj]

Is there a quota in the constructin industry? If so, how does it work..

..girls look sexy in hard hats:ok:

[stillalbatross]

Definately something going on, if you look at Air NZ hiring over the past decade I'd say the females that got interviews had about a half to a quarter of the experience that the males had............maybe they were the most experienced females out there but it is a little absurd...............likewise the females that got in on equal terms with the males, from those that I've spoken to, disagree with the policy and want to be treated equally.

Then there's the couch interview..........................

[WITCH]

Which the majority of males would fail miserably :}

[prospector]

But, unfortunately, that majority is getting smaller as the years role by.

[AviARTrix]

Thanks, everyone for your thoughts. I don't agree with quotas for anything, at all - I think they're completely wrong! But I've heard completely unsubstantiated rumours that they exist and wanted to see what others had heard/found. Keen for any more feedback.

[stillalbatross]

In an interview a wee while ago 7 applicants had 3500-6100 hours and 1 applicant had under 600 with about a hundred multi. "under 600" got in with less hours than you would have thought a regional job would need. Which one was the female?you figure it out. The pre-interview 20+ hours in the 737 sim going over the profile sorted out any problems in the sim ride.

[Lodown]

Quota?

Isn't that some type of extinct New Zealand bird? Rumours persist that it still exists in some pilots' imaginations.

[El Oso]

Similar experiences in the 1990's before I left NZ. Don't know if it still happens but sounds like it...

Eagle during slow times would often take females with the bare minimum (1,000 & 100 ME, CPL) while guys with double that and many extras couldn't even get interviews. It happenned so often it became a source of regular crew room gossip. Several from one Ardmore based outfit in particular - almost looked like a pipeline. Also heard about training probs with some of them but were never ever "chopped". Just keep training em until they can fly... etc.

If I were a good female pilot who had genuinely worked my way up this kind of thing would really P*ss me off. I knew one female instructor in Air NZ regionals who told me she felt angry when she saw the kind of young females getting hired / promoted etc. She had a few choice words to describe them too!

I have seen similar in QF and CX so nothing new. Why don't they just admit it?

:ok:

[DeBurcs]

Pilot is an ASEXUAL word, without bias or gender or race differentiationAnd yet when you hear a female PA in the cabin, you still get the smirks, sideways looks and sly comments between some of the pax.

Seems for some people, the word "pilot" conjures up images of manhood. Anything else is lesss than expected.

Seems you're trying to change human nature with this equality thing. Like it or not, there is still a lot of punters out there who would prefer to hear Chuck Yeager's manly voice re-assuring them they will be safely delivered to the destination in one piece, y'all...

Why don't you ever see any female garbage "men"?

[Highbypasss]

Why don't you ever see any male tuck shop "ladies"?

...................................................:cool: H

[Capt Claret]

I were one once. A male tuck shop lady, that is.

[Foyl]

It really makes me wonder if the person who ever made the decision to hire someone for their looks ever felt so comfortable with that decision the day that everything turned to sh!t and their family's life was dependant on the skills of the person in the pointy end. Think the size of their t!ts would matter then?

[Zhaadum]

They would make good airbags though....just kidding!