Brainstorming for building a small business.. freight

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Hi all!!

I am begining to get all kind of information for a business plan that I will like to bring to reality.

I want to start a small business with a Cessna 206, carrying small packages, documents, etc...

Please, post any idea that comes to your head, commercial, product innovation, pricing, operations, services, costs reductions, .. etc...

Thanks

[Stratocaster]

...would you like French fries with that ?
:}

[CR2]

You're not asking for much are you?

Contracting for FEDEX perhaps?

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Thanks Mr. Strato (you better change your strings and use a tuner for that strat)..:yuk:
French fries with ketchup will be fine!! :}

I know I´m asking for too much, but they are just ideas...:ok:

[Flying Mechanic]

In my Engineer days , I worked for Maint co, they had one of the Mechanics flying around the place( in a Comanchee) picking up Aircraft spare parts usually for AOG aircraft. Go to a 10 aircraft maint company's and offer then your product.........you never know.
I used to fly a 206 from PNG to Oz with a full payload of Crayfish...good bucks in that.
The other one is filling your 206 with Gourmet food from Harrods and flying to the french riveira, so all the trendy french can say they have Harrods food delivered to them fresh from london!
Food for thought!
Cheers FM

[redsnail]

I used to do night freight in a Shed.

The biggest worry I can see is flying in winter if the a/c has no de-ice/anti-ice gear on it. It won't take long to ice up and that'll lead to all sorts of bother.

You should be able to get ~500kg of payload in it and ~2 hours worth of fuel. Whether or not this will be enough is another question.

I used to fly the C206 and C207 in the outback of Australia. (No ice to worry about)

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Thanks a lot guys for sharing your freighting experiences in this forum..

Redsnail.. from your comments, I will definitely consider anti/de-icing equipment..

A Flying mechanic with the spare parts on board it´s maybe what some companies might need.. Good idea about the spares and the Gourmet freight (I´ll keep that one, people might like fresh gourmet food at any time)!!

Thanks!! I hope to get more ideas from freighter people involved here.. never know.. maybe some day I end up contracting a few pilots, besides myself:ok:

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

I don´t want my business idea to die.. please.. come on keep this up and give some good ideas like "redsnail" and "flying mechanic" did..

I am going over the business plan and should end it around november..

I might begin with a Cessna 206 (de-ice equipped) or similar.. small packages..documents.."Gourmet food"..etc.. all around spain..

Does anybody knows any C206 for rent in europe?
Anybody has contacts in spain which I could reach for business, any enterprise that might need urgent transport?
Any good names for the company?



:ok:

[Just Boxes]

The freight company I work for has retrofitted their fleet of Aero Commanders with TKS anti-ice system.

It consists of porous titanium panels installed on the leading edges of the wings, horizontal and vertical stabilizer, a spray bar on the windshield and slinger rings on the props.

We have a 17 Gallon tank installed in the aircraft for the system, and on normal setting uses 4.5 GPH, or 8.5 GPH on max setting.

Truely an excellent system, and well worth the investment if you anticipate flying in known/forecast icing conditions.

A company based in Florida also installed it on their 210s.

As for freight suggestions in a 206...maybe blood specimens, transplant organs, paperwork going to a centralized location - ie cheques, blueprints etc.

Good Luck

[Daysleeper]

Dont forget at the moment IMC & Night public transport in a single is illegal in Europe. It might change in the future but for now its a no go.



For flying engineers around, in a 206 is likely to be too slow and have too short legs. Used to do a lot of it, minimum was a c310, but normally a Twin turbine/ light jet.

Even a turbo stationair only gives you 600 kilos between empty and max take off weight. Its not a lot of freight and you cant go very far.

The Harrods idea has some merit as you could avoid the public transport issues. However you'd probably do better just sticking it in your luggage and going easyjet.

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

So here is the situation at the moment..

Cessna 206 freighter but possible fast passenger conversion, de-ice equipped, two pilots sharing 2-3 short legs a day, around 500 kgs-leg.

Gourmet food, fresh fish, biological stuff, documents, spares...

We need more ideas.. operations, handling, delivering of goods, sales, etc...

Let´s keep it up and make some pilots find a position in a C206..

:ok:

[Buster Hyman]

I assume that all the contributors so far are now shareholders in your venture?:hmm:

The AOG plan was a real money spinner at my old firm. Pick an airline with an older fleet that relies heavily on overnight maintenance in outports...5% ought to do me!:ok:

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

:E I´ll think about that share in a near future..

You´ve got to be more explicit if you want to gain that 0.5%:rolleyes:

Regards..

[Buster Hyman]

Well...you've got to come up with more than 5% if you want explicit!!:p Jet Blast is a better place for explicit!:ooh:
...building a small business...
I'm suprised no-one has mentioned starting with a big one!

[FlyHigher]

Hi FAA fit

I know a guy who owns a Cessna 402 and he is looking to get some work for it. :ok:

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Thanks FlyHigher.. nice aircraft.. maybe it´s too much to begin with, but never know. Where is the a/c located, do you have more info?

Buster Hyman.. I never said 5% but 0.5%.. you have to look better.. but in that case I´ll give you a share of 0.75 for being that explicit :E

Thanks.. let´s get it up!! :ok:

[CargoMatatu]

Buster

I don't think I could get it up for 0.5%, or even 0.75%:(

Gotta be more to life than that:}

May the Matatu be with you.

Matatu Man:cool:

[Buster Hyman]

Yeah, but if the first shipment is a skip full of Viagra, you'll have trouble getting it down!!!:}

I looked okay thanks FAA etc, etc, I noted your error & chose to reiterate my terms!:E

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

:} Matatu Man and Buster Man :}

:hmm: What to do with the rebels?.. I´ll keep my offer of 0.75% and maybe we can raise it if the contribution to the business plan are good and explicit :ooh:

We have to get the business running before wasting the shares.. :ok:

[meatball]

gonna need business plan, money galore ( easy 80 percent over planned initial capital ) unless this is great theatrics at work. careful, i might write the book before you. hey guys, keep the yarn going:D

[Ghostie31]

wanna train me up and i'll fly it for u!!

:D

i dont cost too much!

[Flymani]

If you want to start a small business with limited capital/risk, stay away from operating any aircraft.

If you've got capital, buy real information, this is a rumour network....

[Kiwiguy]

Aren't you putting the horse before the cart ?

First find the potential clients who aren't getting the services they need. Ask them to identify in writing what their needs are both in terms of volume, frequency and seasonal terms.

Once you have a potential cargo identified by clients as opposed to your wish list, then you can go to a financier and say "Here is a need and I know how to solve it if you fund me"

Go look for clients first.

Secondly look for the operator of an IFR twin who only uses it by day and ask what they'd say to you using it by night ?

Remember too that you need to factor in scheduled maintenance when your sole aircraft is not available. So now we're talking at least two aircraft.

How about cut flowers from Holland to UK ?
Very seasonal though. Seafood is always lucrative. Fish from Santander to wherever they want fish ?
Gotta find the need first and then satisfy it. I don't think you're ready yet because you haven't thought it through far enough. harsh thing to say but you need to go through about five drafts of this business plan before you're ready. You need failure to sharpen your pencil because once you're up and flying with loans to repay it's too late to find you haven't done the homework.

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Hi guys.. I´m back..

Like promised, I have my first draft done and believe me, it´s not an easy business!!

So far, I really like many of the stuff shared in the forum, but got to sharpen the pencil and make at least 4 more drafts, like kiwiguy said, to draw a nice conclusion.

By now, I hope more ideas and whatever comes to minds regarding this bussiness are shared here.

Aircraft chosen still a C206, as it is probably the most affordable and logical to begin with (500kgs payload). Fliying time will be around 02:00 hours and carrying : spares, fish, biological stuff, documents, etc..

The most difficult part will be obviously getting the clients, ideas?
Can not promise something not working yet, just to get a client.. so it is really a difficult task.. To begin flying might take a few months so it is very risky to reach target clients before that can really happens..

:confused:

[Phil Brockwell]

Maybe I only skimmed the whole thread, but how are you going to offer this without an AOC. And if you are going to get an AOC, how are you going to operate a VFR only aircraft (in most EU countries).


Phil

[FAA fit / JAR unfit]

Good question Phil..

The aircraft will operate daytime only and will be IFR equipped and only local flights within Spain.

The AOC is another question and I might need professional help for this issue.. any suggestions for the AOC? I have a guide on how start with the operations manual in order to get the AOC but it is a very simple guide and it doesn´t help much.

:confused:

[Phil Brockwell]

I think the operating license should be looked at long before you decide on an aircraft and how many airframes you want to operate. I assume the requirements in Spain are the same as the UK as far as personnel goes. You will need skilled personnel as post holders, Chief Pilot, Accountable Manger, Ops Manager, Engineering Manager and Quality manager. Even if the posts are shared, the overhead costs of salaries required for these people will amount to more than the purchase price of your aircraft over a loan period.

The maths in my head goes something like this. The 206 costs say $550 per hour to operate, it can operate 500 hours per year, thats $275,000, if you make 25% margin thats under $70,000 per anum to pay staff, phone bills, marketing, AOC charges and aircraft finance.

If you make more than 25% margin someone else would have already done it. And they have.

To me it just does not look practical.

However. If you want to test the market, have your company created, i.e. branding, website, promotional material etc and have a go, speak to the existing local operators and put their aircraft forward to your targetted client base with a small margin.

Phil