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ZIP TY
24th May 2005, 06:48
Any one got any news on the EBA report back meetings ?
Haven't heard a thing about how the meetings have gone.
:confused:

hangar 9
24th May 2005, 06:59
We don't get to vote for another 2 weeks or so and they wouldn't allow any other voting, ie. "vote of no confidence " and the like.

We are totally shafted, same as every other EBA.

F#$& the Government , F#$% the Airline and F#$% those Ar$e H@!es running the Union.

Hand me a resignation form.

ZIP TY
24th May 2005, 07:35
Hang in there hangar9.
I know of several LAME's looking into getting the AMWU to represent Lame's at the next EBA.

By the ~~~ the idea of getting a pin number to vote online means that someone will be able to track your vote.
Secret ballot my @#$%

The masked goatrider
24th May 2005, 09:15
Hold off on the resignations boys. All you will do is throw your vote away at the next election for the Federal Executive. They are encouraging angry members to leave. If 300 or 400 of us leave it will ensure that the same ar$eh0le$ get re-elected. It will play into their hands.

The problem is not the union it's the people running it. The election is 12 months away and there is a well ogranised take over team that are fully prepared to assume control of the Bexley office. Send me a PM if you want more info.

They plan to use professionals to negotiate the eba. They are going to sack Chris R and stand up for the members at all costs. They come from a new generation that seeks peace and unity with all other Qantas unions.

sys 4
24th May 2005, 14:18
yeap that's right masked goat rider,tonight in Syd at H245/HM meeting one member got up and made statement that he was not getting fair representation for his money,the exec that where there which where the bargining committee had told him should leave the union then if he thought that.This is what they want they want to fustrate the membership and have them leave before there vote can be counted in nexted years election.

Turbo 5B
25th May 2005, 00:40
At that same meeting the Industrial officer misrepresented the associations powers, the members rights and the interpretation of the EBA package.
The executive misrepresented the members feedback over the proposal by not tallying all the received feedback including member motions that were passed.
Trustee 1 did a runner after verbally abusing members.
The H/M councillor refused to admit that he voted for the package,even though he did, (instead thinking it was more important to attack the person asking the question) even though his own area of representation gave it a resounding thumbs down.
The executive admitted that they did not consult with heavy maintenance employees over the ot bank.
The industrial officer stated that if one of the areas was sold to another employer then the employees were entitled to a redundancy package if they didn't want to go and that this was the big selling point of the whole deal.
When questioned on this he had to admit that that that wasn't in fact the case and that we didn't have the right to ask for a package if the new employer wanted us to work for them.
What was the big selling point then?
Ring the office and ask Mr C.R what the truth really is.
The result of this meeting...
Exposure of the Executives bargaining committe as a bunch of unproffesional morons that have been comprehensively worked over by the qantas negotiating team.

ZIP TY
25th May 2005, 06:14
We've just had our meeting.
I can't belive the cr#p that was dished out by our executive.
C.R. stood out front and spouted the company propaganda just like Cox had his hand up C.R's back.

We were told that Syd were in favour of this agreement and that Melb were just troublemakers.

Trish when pushed admitted that THEY modified the O/T clause to REMOVE the restriction on how many times QF can stand people down!! The original QF offer was a max of 38hrs per year, the new offer is limitless. The negotiating committee were proud of this achievment.
Can you belive this B.S.?

None of the questions asked were directly answered.
M.O'R. said there was no division between Line & Heavy, yet still pointed out the differences regarding Licence payments :confused:

These people actually belive this is a great deal and we should jump at the oppurtunity to screw ourselves.

I.m no longer upset just totally depressed how a group of individuals can shaft the majority and still stand up and say the are looking after us
:yuk:

Mr Qantas
25th May 2005, 06:59
so a few vocal pinheads have decided they want more money than the rest of us and try to reck some meetings. The one I went to didnt have the troublemakers and overall the men were quiet content with the offer. We had to give them something to get rid of that transmision clause and if ot bank is it then so be it. All credit to the expeirienced leaders to have it removed and if the greedy HM staff could only look at what youve saved insted of the money then maybe we all better off. So get over yourselves and start to look at what you do have and what we can all loose if we want to FIGHT for a bigger payrise.

hangar 9
25th May 2005, 07:17
Well the back pay has gone if we say shove it, after tax there isn't that much anyway. It is worth a little loss I think to get a better deal. Nothing worth fighting for unless we go back to our original claim, we need to do something about the heavy chains around our neck first.

How can we cut them away???

Redstone
25th May 2005, 07:25
The meeting last night in Syd has convinced me that the exec. are not to be trusted. To be lied to like that while they keep a straight face.........

It is vitally important that we spread the word about feeling at these meetings to all we know around the country because it is obvious that they will lie.

ZIP TY
25th May 2005, 08:38
Mr Qantas, you are obvisously a level 12 working in Int Line to be so short sighted and selfish. You will be next on the hit list use your head and stand down from the executive.

The masked goatrider
25th May 2005, 08:45
Well the back pay has gone if we say shove it, after tax there isn't that much anyway.
Why do you think this is the case? You must have been listening to the Fed Exec rubbish. They've been running around the country telling everyone this but you can have a look at our last EBA

The parties agree to commence negotiations on a new collective enterprise agreement no later than three months prior to the expiry date of this Agreement. The parties are committed to complete negotiations on the new agreement prior to the expiry of this Agreement. Qantas will continue to apply the terms of this Agreement to all employees covered by it until the new agreement takes legal effect. The operative date of the new agreement will be the first pay period on or after 1 January 2005.
The only way you could lose the backpay is if the union agree to allow Qantas to breach the terms of your last EBA. They can't do it legally. Don't listen to the lies from the front table. Just vote no and ask for a new negotiating team.

Redstone
25th May 2005, 10:28
Zip ty, just ignore him. I don't think he even works at Q, just fishing for a bite.

Mr Chairman
25th May 2005, 12:09
The proposed overtime banking system is a back door method of bringing in contract labour, something that Qf has being trying for a long time. With contract labour you only bring the people in when you want them and when the work has being completed then its good bye to the employees until they are needed again. Unfortunatly people working contracts will only come if the money is right and Qf has never believed in paying the right money either to its permanent employees or to any contractors. So they proposed OT banking system alleviates two problems for Qf,
1. Employees will only be in the hanger when the Aircraft is in the hanger. 2. Pay Rates will stay the same. No need to pay the workers fat contracting rates.

Of course this suits the ALAEA as people who are on contracts are generally not members of any union and all unions main job is to get and retain members.
As far as the 3% per year is concerned its simply is not enough, NSW police force are looking at between 20% and 24% depending on rank, and thats on top of generous pay increases over the last few years. NSW public nurses are getting 12% and holding out for 16%. So 3% is very disappointing, but its exactly what the company offered in January when the EBA negotiations started. Our 6.6% seems to be long forgotten by the ALAEA.
So in my opinion I think we have being sold a dude by the Association who are more worried by the number of paying members and their own long term prospects with the company.
Vote No and stick one up the Bastards
Things can only get better.

Mean, Nasty & Tired
25th May 2005, 12:17
New Suit 100% Italian Cashmere - $1,399

New Shoes Italian Leather - $154

New Italian silk tie - $57

New Thumb ring (Gift from Phillipe) - $32

New walk picked up from Madam Suiss Hall of Dancing - $45

Look on you face when

a) You see a hundred angry men wishing to string you up,

b) you realise adrenalin is brown,

c) you realise it's seeping into your shoes

d) no ones there to hold your hand

PRICELESS


They scoff from their ivory towers but soon they will fall and it will not be without casualty
:ok:

ZIP TY
26th May 2005, 07:20
Thanks redstone, just feeling a little down after witnessing the most arrogent show of self worth I have ever seen.

How far are the executive prepared to errode our conditions for their own management ambitions.


To those who are party to this disgusting show,just remember what has just happened to your hero Mr. Potatoehead. You could not have had an executive do more to shaft members for his own gain and company glory. QF dropped him so fast its was most rewarding to watch.

Turbo 5B
26th May 2005, 09:18
I think that the executives complete disdain for the members will be their downfall.
Their arrogance and vacuum cleaner salesmanship is obvious to anyone at the meetings and this will bring them undone.
JUST VOTE NO FOR THE GOOD OF THE ASSOCIATION

The masked goatrider
26th May 2005, 11:40
Nice to see some of the Exec copping some heat over their roles in the EBA joke. Intersting that the HM reps both voted in favour of endorsing the agreement. Just for the record, there are 9 Fed Exec members who hail from Melbourne. Only one of them voted in favour of recommending this rubbish to the members. He is the unemployed Federal Secretary. The rest in favour all came from the north.

Ultralights
26th May 2005, 12:24
Only one of them voted in favour of recommending this rubbish to the members. He is the unemployed Federal Secretary. The rest in favour all came from the north.
dont go blaming north and south for whatever, it will only create more division in the ranks, unless of course, thats is what your aiming for with that comment?:suspect:

AN LAME
26th May 2005, 12:48
Just for the record, there are 9 Fed Exec members who hail from Melbourne. Only one of them voted in favour of recommending this rubbish to the members.

And the other MEL inmbeciles left the room so that they weren't present to vote. If they'd stayed they may have been able to influence the outcome...as they keep saying they want to.
D!ckheads. As usual.

Mean, Nasty & Tired
26th May 2005, 18:49
Well it good to see the unemployed fed sec is willing to comment

Influence the vote ?, what arrogant lies,
15 exec present
8 EBA comm - all yes voters
7 others - all no voters

you just wanted a 8/7 result so you could say it was a 'hard fought' exec decision

Start looking for work, you've been bludging off us long enough

The masked goatrider
27th May 2005, 05:08
The division was created when the EBA committee was made up. How can yoiu have an EBA committee to handle the QF EBA when 5 of the 6 QF Councillors are excluded. The fact that 4 came from Vic and one from SA is just that. A fact. This division just plays into the airlines hands something our members are getting use to from our union. Welcome back bearded one.

Crystal Marina
28th May 2005, 06:49
You thickheads just don't get it do you. The exec voted the way they did through concerns for the jobs of their heavy maintenance engineers. The way I see it it is a survival package for the radical numbnuts in the heavy maintenance sheltered workshops yet you fail to recognise this.

Get over it boys and girls and wake up and smell the roses because if you don't it maybe too late for all of you. Melbourne heavy maintenance must be the biggest burden engineering has and I beleive they were the most vocal group. I sometimes wish this EBA would got down and then see them all whinge when they are sold off. Who would they blame? The exec of course, because they didn't do enough to save the heavy maintenance bases.

Grow up children and stop living in your antiquated, head-in-the-sand existance that is very prevalent amoungst the blue team, but is slowly but surely working its tenticles into the red heavy maintenance team.

Realise what the sensible ones amongst the exec have attemped to do for you all and do not have your visions blurred by the hollow promises of those that are not so sensible.

I would love to see your heros on the exec go in to bat for you. I hope all of you are ready for extended industrial turmoil. Then in finality get chewed up and spat out by the company and come back to you with a lesser deal.

Do so at your own peril. All I can say is that I am glad I no longer have to put up with this.:ok:

Turbo 5B
28th May 2005, 10:49
That's a very interesting view that you have Crystal,
Could you explain how, in laymans terms, that a voluntary O/T bank that is of such a cr@p nature that nobody will use it will be the saviour of us Heavy Maintenance Numbnuts.
I would have thought that if things were so dire that a compulsary O/T bank would be the only thing that would keep the wolves from the door.
Perhaps even our managers could come down and explain to us the state of affairs and request our assistance in saving our jobs.
Hey, maybe we could shut down AVV and bring the work back in.
There wouldn't be the peaks and troughs to require O/t banking then.
Anyway when you servicing buffoons come under the Heavy Maint. Blanket you won't be so smug.

Crystal Marina
29th May 2005, 08:16
Turbo 5B,

A voluntary overtime bank is all that management could negotiate for this EBA and they prefer that to no overtime bank.

If nobody will use the voluntary overtime bank then what is your problem? You have argued against yourself!!!!!!!!!!!

I doubt very much that Avalon will ever shut down. But if I was a betting man I would say that it will expand, hopefully not to take your job.

You must have missed my last sentence. This will never effect me!

Eagleboy69
30th May 2005, 13:21
CM you are a fool, my man.

If you think that OT banking will remain in it's currently proposed voluntary form, think again...

And if you think that it will only ever apply to Heavy Maintenance, I strongly believe that you are very very wrong...

If the vote is 'Yes', then when the company wishes to expand it into other areas, they will not need to put it to a vote because all the members of the association will have already voted for it.

And you can't use the defence that you only voted for Heavy Maintenance to have it either. How would that look ?

Crystal Marina
30th May 2005, 22:26
Eagleboy 69, If the overtime bank is to progress to anything but voluntary it will have to be negotiated I trust so what is your problem.

If the vote gets up then again I see no problem because it is only VOLUNTARY.

Get over it Eagleboy69.

Sunfish
30th May 2005, 23:13
Nah mate, everyone knows that there are "volunteers" and "volunteers" just wondering how people will be pressured to volunteer.?

Eagleboy69
31st May 2005, 03:50
CM,

Once again you are not listening...

This is he thin edge of the wedge for the company.

There is a much greater plan in the wind and when that happens everything in Sydney will change, quite radically.

My issue is that there was not even any consultation with the members as to the makeup of the OT Bank and how it is to work.

Especially with those in heavy maintenance who will be immediately effected, with all of Sydney Maintenance to follow in the very near future. This is where the members will not be able to say no, because they voted yes for a voluntary OT Bank.

Then when the next EBA comes along, if it is in an EBA form or not, they will demant compulsory and the assn will buckle yet again. Unless the talk of a major spill next june are true and come to fruition, that is.

Do yourself a favour steve and try to listen to what is actually being said by those of us on these pages.