Air Crash Investigations - Concorde 7:30 pm

[blueloo]

Just a reminder: Air Crash Investigation/Seconds From Disaster is on - If indeed it is a Seconds from disaster renamed as Air Crash Investigations, you will probably have chewed your leg off or killed a nearby pet in frustration watching a painful american attempt at a hard hitting documentary.

If it is a proper show from Air Crash Investigations, then I take it all back. It is scheduled at Wed 730pm Channel 7
(Sydney), with the usual channel 7 plus or minus 10, 15, 20 minutes



Air Crash Investigations - Concorde (60 mins , Rated: PG)
Genre: Documentary

Concorde was the world's first supersonic airliner a symbol of luxury and high technology. In July 2000, a hundred people in Germany board on a charter flight to New York for the holiday of a lifetime. But Concorde catches fire on take off and crashes into a nearby hotel one mile from the end of the runway, killing all on board and 4 people in the hotel. Investigators analysed the accident second by second and discover a piece of fallen metal on the runway proved to be fatal.

[Capn Bloggs]

piece of fallen metal on the runway proved to be fatal.
Not to mention taking off overweight, downwind, pulling the on-fire engine back to idle before the gear came up...

[king oath]

And getting airborne below V2.....

[PPRuNe Radar]

And getting airborne below V2.....

Don't most aircraft rotate at Vr ?? Which usually seems to be slightly slower than V2. Or was Concorde different ??

[DirectAnywhere]

a hundred people in Germany board on a charter flight to New York Hmmm, given that the accident occurred out of CDG, if this is indicative of the standard of "investigation" it should make for interesting viewing.


Concorde Accident (http://www.concordesst.com/accident/accidentindex.html) Includes links to all reports, including this one, the official BEA Report (http://www.bea-fr.org/docspa/2000/f-sc000725a/pdf/f-sc000725a.pdf).

This report states that V1 was 150kt, VR 198kt and V2 220kt. Actual rotation, however, was at 183kt and maximum achieved airspeed was 211kt, although it was little above 200kt for most of the time airborne. The zero rate of climb airspeed (Vzrc) was calculated as 205kt with one engine failed and gear down.

The report goes on to stateThe crew had no way of grasping the overall reality of the situation. They reacted instinctively when they perceived an extremely serious but unknown situation, which they were evaluating by way of their sensory perceptions. Each time the situation allowed they applied the established procedures in a professional way. The gear wouldn't come up because of a problem in the gear logic circuit either associated with damage to, or the absence of, the left hand main gear door. Thrust output from engines 1 and 2 was varying wildly from as much as 80% to as little as 3% nominal thrust. This was identified in the report as being due to, for engine number 1 the ingestion of tyre debris or hot gases, and for engine number two, hot gases alone. The entire sequence from the first loss of thrust to the impact took some 40 seconds.

It also states that a rejected takeoff, had the crew grasped the seriousness of the situation, would have resulted in a high speed overrun and, given the fire that was already burning, it is very likely that the aircraft would have been destroyed by fire very rapidly.

It states further that even had all four engines been operating normally, the damage caused by the fire to the wing structure and control surfaces of the aeroplane would have led to a loss of control.

In essence, these poor people were doomed as soon as the fire started.

[DeltaSix]

blueloo


The Seconds from Disaster is on at another time - I think 9:30pm ( Sydney ). It was not a rename from Air Crash.

Anyway, looks like the much awaited discussion amongst our peers has already started.

So, what was punctured by the piece of metal, was it the engine or the wing ?

[SkySista]

If what I hear is correct, the tyre shredded, puncturing the fuel tank which ignited (via?) the fuel being ingested???

Anyway, this Concorde program looks like "Seconds" - I have a tape at home from last year of the same prog, titled "Seconds From Disaster" (taped off Foxtel)

The "Crash Files" one a few years before that was better, I think....

[blueloo]

It was a rename. *again*


Pure crap american documentary. Could have watched the last 10 minutes and seen the entire show.


I am still waiting for the "in depth" investigation, but i won't hold my breath.

The background music was so loud at times, you could almost not hear the commentry!

[Dawn Raid]

Correct me if I'm wrong..........

but I think the 'seconds from disaster' program covers a variety of disasters and the one about the Concorde was just one of them.

I seem to recall watching one of the episodes about the Russian Nuclear disaster ( can't spell the name of the town - sounds like Cher noble)

[blueloo]

Ya Seconds from Disaster is a series, a crap series. Concorde, KLM/Teneriffe, Chernobyl, a Car/Pax ferry, A Train... it goes on.

[king oath]

I wasted time warching this pap last night. What a stretched out time filler with almost no technical merit. After every commercial break we went back over the thin material already covered, just in case the lowest common denominator in the audience hadn't grasped it yet.

Aimed at the mums and dads who wouldn't know one end of an aircraft from the other.

But then what did I expect. Prime time TV on a major network. If you want a real documentary that thinks about the subject you need to look on one of the Foxtel docco channels.

If you taped it, erase it.

[NAMPS]

Yep, pretty dodgy.

Funny how the guy kept repeating 'we have reviewed the investigation report in depth to explain how this disaster really occurred'. They just forgot to tell us about it.

I watched the 'Seconds from Disaster' show about the fire in the tunnel after (I'm a glutton for punishment). I thought I saw what suspiciously looked like the same footage of firies being called out. Dodgy or what!!??

[Whiskey226]

mmm... Watched it last night - they covered the Mont Blanc tunnel fire. Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a winner!

Quote: The cars wouldn't start, as EXPERTS discovered they needed oxygen for their engines to run...

I wish I was an expert, they know so much:{

[John Citizen]

Now using cutting edge computer technology, we reveal exactly what went wrong.

Now be rewinding the events of the fateful day and by going deep into the investigation, we can reveal what really happened.

Cutting edge computer simulation will take us where no camera can go, into the heart of the disaster zone.

The French Bureau of Air Accidents sent their top investigators. Using their data, we can now piece together the deadly chain of events to find out what really caused this terrible tragedy.

Using advanced computer graphics based on the official report we go deep into the investigation to unravel the deeply chain of events.

Our graphics can simulate a virtual camera on the runway to reveal the cause of the accident.

The most likely explanation can be seen in this computer simulation.

Computer graphics show how Concorde would have looked.

[tinpis]

soz...pissed :8

[blueloo]

I finished my first leg in the first half of the show, lucky the neighbours dog wasnt around.

[Stiff Under Carriage]

If it was anything like the Teneriefe episode its bound to be a waste of time, it was the most monotonous thing I have ever watched.

[Continental-520]

Yeah, if I had my time again, I doubt I would've watched it.


What irritated me was the reference to "Concorde".

"Concorde this, Concorde that, Concorde was seconds from distaster..."

It implies singular context.

It's not the only Concorde in the world for christ sake.

They wouldn't say "747 was just seconds from disaster"

or

"747 overran the runway"

Illustrative of the amateurs who've made the program, clearly.


520.

[SkySista]

totally agree. the so-called 'cutting edge graphics' looked like basic animation, not CGI... I mean, Pixar could have done better! :}

Haven't seen it in a while, but the Crash Files one at least tried to explain about FOD (what it is and where it comes from) and explained how the spacer shredded the tyre and then how the fuel/engine fire started, and how this would affect the aircraft (e.g. what happens when you get assymmetrical thrust & lift,. how they were pretty much stuffed because the airflow was disturbed) etc etc.

Seriously, I dunno, but if I were Cineflix, I wouldn't be putting my name on this :yuk:

Is it just me, or was the first series of (the real) Air Crash better? (eg Swissair 11 etc)..

Sky

[DeltaSix]

Well, you guys have to realise that it is because it's a "marketing strategy". They are using phrases that they think would hook viewers especially for the ones who are just looking for some entertainment/time waster and not for some technical info on the accident. If you want this, the internet is there. TV will not replace a factual accident report.

This program is not a Transport Safety Board accident documentary/report.

It is just for entertainment for those who likes watching accidents.

This is like selling an ice block to an eskimo if you say the right things.

D6

[Pinky the pilot]

The best term for this particular program is imho the same term that can be used for such programs as 'A Current Affair' and others of their ilk.... "infotainment"
It cannot be in any stretch of the imagination be regarded as journalism, critical or otherwise.
I would term it brainless pap for brain dead masses!:yuk:
A perfect example of 'dumbing down' of what could be otherwise an informative medium.
You only live twice. Once when
you're born. Once when
you've looked death in the face.

[HEALY]

Some graphic comments made too for 7:30pm. " The smell of burning flesh" !!!

Now kiddies off to bed...sweet dreams

[blueloo]

mmm burning flesh, i wonder if the Marshmellows, were 'seconds from disaster"