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BEagle
10th Apr 2005, 07:16
Apologies if this has been mentioned before recently, but it seems that the 'oil fumes' rumour associated with the BAe146/Avro RJ85 series has raised its head again. In today's Sunday Times, the following article reports an incident which occurred on a Flybe Bae 146 aircraft:

Leaking oil fumes threat to air crews

Dipesh Gadher, Transport Correspondent

THE co-pilot of a British passenger jet had to be put on oxygen in mid-flight after being overcome by a suspected leak of engine fumes into the cockpit, safety records have revealed.
The alert at 26,000ft meant the captain of the Flybe airlines plane had to land single-handedly in Belfast even though the fumes had left him “in a state of euphoria”.

The flight was one of five last year in which pilots are said to have been “incapacitated” after breathing in potentially toxic fumes given off by engine oils leaking into the cabin.

Details of the incident, which is being investigated by the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA), have emerged amid growing concern about the health risks of such leaks to airline staff and passengers.

The British Air Line Pilots Association is so concerned by the problem it is hosting a conference on contaminated cabin air next week. Symptoms reported by pilots include dizziness, fatigue and memory loss.

The pilots who fell ill on the Flybe flight from Gatwick to Belfast on December 8 last year were at the controls of a BAe 146, an aircraft that has previously experienced fume-related incidents.

A mandatory occurrence report filed by the airline with the CAA says: “During the cruise, the P2 (co-pilot) felt unwell (faint and breathless with shaking hands) and oxygen was administered for the last 20 minutes of the flight. The P1 (captain) also had a headache with flu symptoms and confirmed to be in a state of euphoria, although successfully landed the aircraft.”

The report adds: “Subsequent investigation identified a fault, now rectified, which may have allowed a small amount of APU (auxiliary power unit) exhaust to enter the cabin airstream.”

The incident is believed to be the most serious fumes-related alert on a British plane since another Flybe flight in November 2000. On that occasion — when the airline was known as British European — the captain complained of feeling light-headed and nauseous and had difficulty in judging height as he brought the plane in to land at Birmingham airport.

The oils used to lubricate aircraft engines contain organophosphates, which have been linked to neurological disorders. Where engines have faulty seals, oil fumes can be drawn into the cabin along with fresh air used in the air-conditioning.

The CAA insists that such contaminated air is not harmful to flight crew or passengers. In a statement, Flybe said: “We remain 100% confident the BAe 146 aircraft always meets and exceeds the relevant regulatory standards in the area of cabin air quality across our fleet.”



I recently returned from MUC to BHX in an 'Avro' and, in flight, noticed the familiar oily smell I remember from flights in buzz 146s (not to mention the signature flap howl). So, is there really an absolute assurance that there is no problem with this type of a/c with fumes being drawn into the air conditioning?

In a week or so I'm flying from FRA to FDH, a route which used to be operated by Eurowings ATR72s but is now operated by Lufthansa Citylines' RJ85s and Eurowings' BAe146s. I shall certainly be having a cautious sniff!

ironbutt57
10th Apr 2005, 07:41
Been an on-going issue with the "Smurf-jet" hasn't it?

Joetom
10th Apr 2005, 13:29
B757's with RR have been doing this for years.

I belive after much talking and little actions, they came up with a super plan to never fill the engine oil to full, think they keep them 1 or 2 quarts from full, think it works, only took 16 years to work it out.

411A
10th Apr 2005, 15:47
Maybe, turbocompressors' time has finally come....once again.:E

LukeEGTE
11th Apr 2005, 15:37
Again?! :uhoh:

I thought the faulty seals had been replaced after the BE incident in 2000?

How can the CAA say that the fumes are no danger when they have resulted in partial incapacitation of the crew?

AOPIS
15th Apr 2005, 15:13
Honeywell have a new seal for the number 1 seal on the 146 which is Service Bulletin (THE 14TH EFFORT)

SB ALF/LF 72-1082FE

Most Australian operated 146s have fitted this new seal which appears to have 'helped' but FlyBe apparently have not chosen to do so.

As of 1400 today, despite the worrying comments made by the Times last Sunday, FlyBe were not down to attend the 'Contaminated Air Protection Conference' organised by BALPA for next week at Imperial College London on 20 & 21 April.

The conference is about the scientific and medical evidence being seen in contaminated air events and the solutions available to resolve this important health and flight safety issue.

AOPIS.ORG

Say again s l o w l y
15th Apr 2005, 16:12
I know 2 ex-flyBE 146 pilots who have both suffered long term health problems that they put squarely down to oil fumes.

matblack
16th Apr 2005, 21:48
Everytime I've flown with this aircraft I experience the poor quality air. Over the past five years I've probably flown 20 times on this type with BA, Aer Lingus and a black one (titan rings a bell). Every one had the same tinge of oil in the cabin air. It's not like a burning oil smell it's more a smell of exhaust fumes with unburnt fuel/oil. It's a shame because apart from the air it's always been a pleasant flight with plently of room as opposed to the usual EMB types.

prop jocket
4th May 2005, 21:28
A lot of work ( and I mean A LOT of work ) has been done on this very issue under the guise of the European Cabin Air Quality Initiative. Many accurate measurements have been taken on flights, targeting where possible aircraft that have had a reported history of oily smells.

The results are to be published shortly - don't know when I'm afraid. Preliminary findings were quite encouraging in as far as when an oily smell was present, the measurable nasties content was surprisingly small. I can't quote figures, but it was suggested that the air coming into your car whilst driving along a motorway was of a poorer quality.

Keep a look out for the report in a crew room near you. In the meantime, keep reporting the smells, otherwise you may miss out on any possible compensation payments when BALPA get their hands on it ( tongue in cheek ).