Typhoon OEU Cranks Up?

[27mm]

Chaps,

Believe that 17 Sqn, alias the Typhoon OEU started at Coningsberg on 1 Apr - best wishes to the mates and gizza trip!

[jwcook]

When's the earliest that they'll get a chance to 'play' with other airforces???, October???;-)

Good luck to all!!.

BAESYSTEMS News (http://www.baesystems.com/newsroom/2005/apr/010405news1.htm)


Cheers

[Soiled Glove]

The first squadron are heading off to Coningsby on schedule

It has got to be a spoof - look at the date on the BAES press release - 1 Apr! Nothing ever leaves BWOS on schedule!

SG

[soddim]

Except the employees!

[Echo 5]

Soiled Glove,

" It has got to be a spoof - look at the date on the BAES press release - 1 Apr! Nothing ever leaves BWOS on schedule "

I would suggest that you're talking through your @rse.

[3xGreens]

Bravo E5,

Too many cynical b@st@rds posting on these threads who know SFA about BAe and/or Typhoon.

The RAF guys converting to the beast just love it. Nuff said ?

[jindabyne]

3G

Agree - soddim you disappoint me

[soddim]

Not nearly as much as BWOS must have disappointed the pilots who would have flown Typhoon if it had been in service on time - whatever the cost.

[engineer(retard)]

Soddim

Unusually, I have to defend BAE a bit.

Many of the delays have been government induced due to fights over workshare, delayed contract lets etc. A good rule of thumb is to to multiply the usual number of problems in contracts by the square of the number of nations involved, and then do the same with the delays and costs.

Retard

[soddim]

Yes, have to agree. Even BWOS were not capable of a monumental delay like that on their own.

[A2QFI]

Of course it is fun to fly but what is it for?

[insty66]

Shooting down other airplanes and blowing stuff up:ok:

:E :ok:

[Echo 5]

soddim,

You and I have bantered in the past with regard to the ineptitude of BWos management in KSA. I certainly would not retract one word and I'm sure that you wouldn't either.

I think however that we should differentiate between BWoS management and the BAe Systems workforce as it is unfair to equate the two.

There are many good people working extraordinary long hours to get projects such as Typhoon and Nimrod up and running. I know of at least two marriage breakups due to individuals working long hours for many months until finally their family lives became non existant. That is the degree of commitment that we are talking about. They have not been helped by the member Governments continually moving the goalposts.

I am not having a pop at anyone in particular but would say to all the smartasses out there who think it funny or smart or fashionable to have a go at BWos/BAe Systems to choose their words carefully in future and not to post uninformed cr@p.

Rant over awaiting incoming.

E5.:O

[uncivilservant]

Not involved with Typhoon (silly name, maybe?), but there is an old maxim - "if it looks right, it is right" - and Typhoon seriously looks the biz. Saw it at a couple of Farnboroughs, the first it looked roughly comparable with F16 etc - why bother, one thought. Two years later, and performance envelope obviously enhanced through testing, it beat the pants off everything - F16, Super Hornet, Rafale and even Gripen (aka poor man's Eurofighter, and personal favourite of any red-blooded SAAB car driver). I well remember it turning really tight circles on reheat, the back end slewing out in an attempt to overtake the front. This is a serious combat aeroplane - and I envy the lucky sods who fly it. At last the RAF will have a decent fighter. Don't knock it - if only UK plc could produce a helicopter half as good. And why aren't we producing a carrier version, instead of buying the overweight, expensive and lacklustre F35?

[Tarnished]

A2QFI: Why so cynical ? And wouldn't you rather be a QWI?

Insty 66: Well said

Echo 5: Damn well said

Uncivilservant: Flew Farnboro in 2002 and it always amazed me when flying the tight circles you talk about that when I looked at the foreplane the leading edges were almost fully down, ie trying to fly "out of the turn" but we still had 7+g on! Ask A2QFI to explain it to you, its all about the aircraft being unstable......

Soddim: if ifs and ands were pots and pans we'd all be rich and happy, if it was easy everyone would be doing it.

Nobody involved in the program either set out to delay it or wanted to see it fail. It is a complex yet capable weapons "system", far more so than a lot of people (even some of those airships taking delivery of it) realise. It is not cheap, but if you pay peanuts......

Saw a USAF News article where General Jumper compared it very favourably against F-22 ant that costs 4 times as much. What price stealth? Maybe someone could provide the link again?

Edited to say: found it myself!

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?storyID=123010102

Tarnished

[Blobby]

As someone who is very close to the boys that fly it (no girls yet), I totally echo what Tarnished has said. As far as all the "doubters" go, give it a chance.

Yes, it is late. Yes it is expensive. Yes it is partially governed by the Germans and Club Med. BUT.....it is awesome to fly. Let us all now draw a line under the problems and issues of the past and move forward. We all know where it's been, but it has an fantastic foundation NOW to build upon so let's leave all the b*ll*cks behind and watch and admire.

The line in the sand has been drawn.

[maxburner]

Tarnished Old Boy,

Well said and well put. Thanks for the link to Gen Jumper's article - a very fair look at the F22 and Typhoon from someone uniquely qualified.

Take care,

[soddim]

Echo 5,

Yes, I've enjoyed your banter and I agree that there is a highly proficient and skilled workforce at BWOS who have been poorly served by their managers - and that was particularly true, as we know, in Saudi.

However, it is the UK company management that has borne responsibility for the cost and production overruns that have recently led to the rapid decline in the company's reputation with the MOD.

The French company THALES is now, apparently, more favoured within MOD than our own home grown last remaining aircraft producer.

Yes, the Typhoon does appear, despite some very silly teething problems, to be performing as it was required to. I agree that is good news but let's not kid ourselves that all is well with the Baron's business or its' products.

[BEagle]

"Sithee' by boogery, yoong lad, therr's nowt wrong wi't prodoocts from owerrr werrks...

Old Mad Maggie said there's allus be brass ferr 't lads at 't werrks for 't aerroplanes ferr 't Airr Forrce; them lads love 't TypHoon an' it'll keep me in Pig Pancreas Pies ferr 't forseeable....."

And with that, 't Bungling Baron Waste o' Space fondled the ears of his faithful but flatulent whippet Boogeroff and tucked in to a particularly choice piece of ram's testicle tart....

[Echo 5]

BEags,

Thou forgot t'mention that t'Baron is partial to a bit of Bury black puddin.:)

[Safeware]

eng(retard)

A good rule of thumb is to to multiply the usual number of problems in contracts by the square of the number of nations involved, and then do the same with the delays and costs.

Ah well, that's A400M b*gg*r*d then :)

sw

[Climebear]

Soddim

our own home grown last remaining aircraft producer.

That will be the one whose majority of shares are owned by foreigners then!

[A2QFI]

Obviously being "fun to fly" is a good thing but it needn't be too high up a list of reasons for spending billions of pounds on it! Obviously when the design was drawn up, the product had some relevance (15-20 years ago). How does it fit in to the next 30 years of RAF operations? I recall that when the first batch was ordered the Press release did not say "This is an amazing aircraft that we have ordered and which the RAF says is exactly what it needs to fulfill its tasks". What actually came out was "This large order will safeguard thousands of skilled lobs in the North West for the next 10 years". So that's all right then! A number of aircraft we can't use in their designed role look better than a closed factory and a lot of workers getting dole instead of salaries.

[Pontius Navigator]

So the OCU started at Coningsby in April. Anyone like to guess when they get the airfix kits to play with?

[Soiled Glove]

Who needs an Airfix kit to play with when you can play with the real thing!

I have heard that performance is awesome:
Take-off roll ~ 7secs,
Barrel rolls at 55000ft,
Sustained 9g turns whilst climbing to stop accelerating,

Show me an airfix kit that gives you that much fun!!

And it keeps workers employed!

Just interested to see how the Singaporeans react to their assessment and whether they buy Typhoon - they are the first country to formally assess the aircraft rather than have it procured for them. IF they buy that will be a massive vote of confidence for the programme, just hope that the politicans don't force a politically correct solution on them. I thought the decision was due soon.

[Safeware]

Believe that 17 Sqn, alias the Typhoon OEU started at Coningsberg on 1 Apr

But in the Mar issue of the MOD's Preview it says, as I recall being the plan, 'Typhoon pilots were eager to settle into their new home in July'. Ops between now and then still being conducted at Warton with dets to Coningsby?

Mind you the same article cites clearances 'now' that aren't - never trust what you read in the papers eh?

sw

[passpartout]

For goodness sake, what is wrong with you people?

This is a major part of the future of the RAF FJ force, like it or lump it.

When did anybody ever get anything that was fully capable at entry into service?

Of course, it's had a painful gestation period, but the ac is here, now and it's getting more stuff every month.

This is an incredible aeroplane, and we should recognise that.

The OEU (not the OCU yet) is flying operations from Coningsby and from what I have heard, they love it. Whenever the first op squadron gets stood up, WE, the UK, will be the envy of NATO, if not the world.

And what's with the fatuous 'Norvun Monkey' accent with the posts?

Some of these posts have proved that a little knowledge is a dangerous/pointless/pompous thing

[jindabyne]

passpartout

Worry not, it's all part of being tempted to contribute to this site. Some (including me from time to time) call it banter. Mostly it's cr*p; even from those with 'Norvun Monkey ' accents. Don't let it stress you old chap. As they say, you have the off-button option.

Meanwhile, agree your line: the jet has great potential (someone will 'pick' on that), and whatever one's persuasion it will be the RAF's combat beast for decades. No option: it's there, it's good, it'll improve, and it'll hold its own far better and far longer than current types have done. And (gm) it will do so, IMHO, as an enduring and required element of HMG military strategy.

Jeez that sounds pompous - but what the hell.

[soddim]

passpartout,

This is a major part of the future of the RAF FJ force, like it or lump it.

Well, that sums up the problem, not the solution.

Yes, the OEU are flying it but does that mean it gets an OT & E in the American way which it has to pass or else we don't pay for it?

I saw the USAF doing OT & E on the F-15 and the contractors were falling over backwards trying to get it through because their jobs depended on it.

Don't let's get too carried away because it flies - it's an aeroplane, it's meant to.

[ORAC]

In the meanwhile on the other side of the pond...

Flight International:

A flight control system flaw allowed a Lockheed Martin/Boeing F/A-22 Raptor to exceed its load factor limits seriously overstressing the airframe........ The stealth fighter reached peaks of +10.1g and -11.7g and AOA exceeded -60 degrees during a divergent oscillation that lasted little more than 3s.....overstressing wing and fin roots to more than 170% of design load limit..... The USAF has not decided whether to repair the F/A-22 - Raptor 4003... :eek:

[BEagle]

I'm amazed that the pilot survived that - not the first time that F-22 s/w has caused divergent oscillations. The first time led to a spectacular, but survivable, crash.

As did the original Gripen s/w.

Whereas 't TypHoon seems to be performing exceptionally well. Good luck to the lucky so-and-sos who'll fly it - truly stunning performance!

[jwcook]

IIRC the F-22 in question had two large external fueltanks, and the 'wobblyness' was initiated by flying through the wake of an F-16.
The estimated damage bill was in the order of US$3-4M, You'd have to wonder what it would take to make one uneconomical to repair ;-).

BTW the RAF Typhoons have a Laser Warning Receiver, I was under the impression it was the only one of the partners to have it, but the Spanish look like they have the sensors, the small lump ahead of the canard, just before the radome and another couple not shown in this picture at the delta wing root towards the rear.

see http://www.eurofighter.starstreak.net/gallery/albums/spanish/eda/ST-001_pre.jpg

Cheers

[Echo 5]

BEags,

............................................................ ............................................
And what's with the fatuous 'Norvun Monkey' accent with the posts?
............................................................ ............................................

You really must stop taking the pi$$ as some find it offensive !!

[BEagle]

't Nawrth? Where's that? Somewhere the other side of Watford?

That is - if there is anything the other side of Watford.

Must say, the folk from clog and whippet land who feast upon pig pancreas pie and rams' testicle tart do seem rather sensitive....

I'm told that, whatever Coronation Street is, it was far more realistic in grainy 405-line black and white.

Sithee and by 'eck, I'll go to the fooot of ower sterrs if 't werrent't!

[jindabyne]

Must make a note - try to do some'at wiv a Scrumpy lilt --- WTS

[Pontius Navigator]

For sceptics and others her is the latest on Typhoon to Coningsby.

Radio reports heralding the arrival of Typhoon (Eurofighter) squadrons bringing hundreds of jobs to RAF Coningsby may have been premature. According to the base's CRO, dates have yet to be confirmed.

The OEU, 17 Sqn, is due to stand up in May but the OCU, 29 Sqn, which trains people to fly the typhoon (sic) is not expected to arrive until later in the summer from BAE Wharton (sic) (British Aerospace).

A further two squadrons will be based at Coningsby in due course.

# A display typhoon will soon be practising above the skies of Coninsgby during the next couple of weeks between 1 and 1.30pm and 4 and 5pm.

ENDS

Clearly this error free and accurate report contains the full story.

The tail piece shows that the turn round time will be less than 2.5 hrs (no irony intended).

[Pontius Navigator]

And at 1458Z the might fighter launched into the air over Coningsby. Two minutes early even.