That smell of old aircraft...

[williamp]

What is it?

I spent a very enjoyable few hours at the excellent Coventry airport museum, and (as always) I noticed that smell that all old aircraft have.

Whether it seems to be a Hurricane, Vulcan, Canberra or BAE One-eleven, they all seem to have the same smell.

Whether the cockpit has been closed for years, or is open to the elements (as with the nose section on top of the terminal at Gatwick) the distinctive smell remains.

What is it? Why aircraft, not old locomotives/cars/ boats?
Why (seemingly) all types of old aircraft, regardless of manufacturer?

Did any pilots get sick of the smell after a while (I think I would)

[tinpis]

Whether it seems to be a Hurricane, Vulcan, Canberra or BAE One-eleven, they all seem to have the same smell.

:(

Fear.

[reynoldsno1]

Leather, plus
.... fuel leaks
.... glycol leaks
.... hydraulic leaks
.... organic leaks :hmm:
.... air leaks :oh:
.... Welsh leaks :ooh:

[Tiger_mate]

"Did any pilots get sick of the smell after a while"

If Aviation is in your blood than you never tire of `that` smell. Sadly there are modern aeroplanes that dont smell like that, although it may be that they just havnt been around long enough yet:O

A long time ago as a young ATC cadet , I clambered into the open cockpit of a Meteor on the Woodvale fire dump. It had sat there with its cockpit missing and open to the elements for years, but still the aroma of flight was present.

Armoured Fighting Vehicles have their own similar smell as well and whilst I do not dispute that leaks various maybe the cause, I wonder if the electrical circuitry plays a part.

One thing for certain, once any metalic item has it, you cannot get rid of it.

[Halcyon Days]

Aaahh the nostalgia/De Havilland?

I remember as a young 14 year old cycling for miles to find an old airfield (Boxted) not even knowing what was there-we had just seen it featured on an old map.
We found several old Tiger Moths in various states of repair/damage? A chap who was in one of the old hangars invited us to sit in one of the Tigers cockpits. As a young lad it was a very special moment. Now if I ever get near to an aircraft of that certain age I can smell that moment and am back as a 14 year old. (Oh that I could bottle it or put it in an aerosol?)
The chap that allowed us this privilege was a gentleman by the name of Percy Hatfield. He owned the company (Airspray) but tragically lost his life crop spraying not long after, in a crash in a Champion Challenger (G-ASSN I think it was).
Years later I found out that Percy had been the wartime pilot of a Catalina and it was he apparently who had found and tracked the Bismarck in the North Atlantic allowing it to later be crippled by Swordfish. (Although I have read some reference books that quote the pilots name as Briggs?)
I didnt really know him as a person but to me he was a hero in more ways than one.

[LowNSlow]

Hot oil, spilt avgas and leather. Mmmmm wonderful...

[treadigraph]

Wonderful smell!

G-ASSN was only registered for less than a month - crashed at Boreham, Essex, 27th July '65. There's a pic of the aeroplane, will see if I can post it tomorrow.

[Onan the Clumsy]

Great question.

I'm with tinpis. I've always thought it was the smell of fear.

[Gainesy]

As a kid in the ATC, I used to scrounge rides in the Bomber Command Bombing School's Hastings and Varsitys at Lindholme.

Coffee on the Hastings was always accompanied by evaporated milk from the can pierced by the Eng's knife. Just the smell of Carnation milk now takes me back to droning around UK in a Hastings.

Never got drinks in the Varsity, but they'd let me drop the odd practice bomb, got quite good at it over the summer hols one year.

Wonder what the H&S Nazis would say at a 13 year old dropping bombs today?:rolleyes:

[Beeayeate]

Mostly I reckon it's the smell of old rubber, that and a pervaisive "sweat" smell mixed with the sickly odour of the Helerene fluid used by the leccies when sleeving cables. The dingy pack has it's own distinctive smell which adds to the mix as does the ozone from the instruments and elec equipment. But mostly it's the rubber components. Whatever is in the mix it is a heady perfume, redolent of days gone by to the thousands of "ex-" blokes that rapturise over it.

:ok:

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

I think it's an 'old British military aeroplane smell'. The Chippy most definatly has it, the Cub, Citabria and the Yak 52 do not (the Citab and Cub have no real smell, rather like modern Pipers and Cessnas, and the Yak has its own, very different, 'Russian' military smell).

Surprised the 1-11 was mentioned. I've never smelt it in an airliner.

Very interesting question.

SSD

[Onan the Clumsy]

very different, 'Russian' military smell Cabbage?

[Compass Call]

This reminds me of the Nimrod. You can go to any airport where a Nimrod has been parked and the smell is unmistakable, even weeks after it has left!!

CC

[LowNSlow]

SSD of course the Cub etc don't have that 'old British military aeroplane smell' . They weren't Britsh!

The Auster does though, especially on a warm summer afternoon..... Not quite as nice as a Chippy but getting there. :D

[henry crun]

Dope continues to give off an odour long after it has been dried, even when it is cracked from long exposure to the sun.

Mix that with the lingering smell of highly leaded petrol and I think that contributes to the overall smell.

[effortless]

It's rubber, leather, canvas, bakerlite, paint and the wiring oh especially the wiring, lovely fabric covered stuff. I think that the main smell is an absence smell. That is the absence of plastic smell.

[Irish Steve]

walked into the VC10 at Duxford a while back. First smell to hit me?

Ancient Racasan, straight out of the Bog:D

How'd I know. They still use it now, albeit with a fresher smell:O , I spent a couple of summers filling all sorts of (modern) things with it.

Most amusing thing about that is the way that it lingers for so long:yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :ugh:

[Genghis the Engineer]

Mrs.G maintains (quite rightly) that she can always tell from the smell if I've had a day at work which involved flying in, or just clambering around, old aeroplanes.

Which reminds me of a cartoon I saw in a flying club newsletter a few years ago, it showed an attractive young lady at a perfume counter, saying to the sales assistant...

"Surely, you must have SOMETHING that smells of old aeroplane".

G

:p

[LOMCEVAK]

It is the smell of freedom!

[Blacksheep]

Ah! Racasan.

The smell of old airliners.

It just isn't the same with these new fangled vacuum toilets.

[Genghis the Engineer]

I do believe LOMCEVAK is finally turning into an old romantic.

G

[LOMCEVAK]

Genghis,

The problem is that nostalgia is not what it was in the good old days!

Rgds

L

[Irish Steve]

It just isn't the same with these new fangled vacuum toilets.

Oh yes it is :D .

Even on the latest vacuum monsters, in theory they still put some racasan in to the tank, probably to make sure that nothing manages to survive in the tanks:E :E.

Believe me, it's no fun watching unmentionable things move around in the hose that are clearly very much alive!!

The other possible reasons are that (a) Racasan helps to mask the stink, and (b), blue is a better colour than a sort of swamp green, which is what it can be if there's no racasan in the system, common occurrence on some inbound flights from certain Eastern European countries:E:E


Then there's things like the A300-600, which seems to need about a week of engineer work and about 500 Ltrs of water and Racasan before the blockages are cleared. Trying to sort that lot out on a 1 Hr turnround can be "interesting"
;)

Then there's the joy of systems that never did hold their water, regardless of how many plugs bungs seals and other devices were used to try and make them work. Worst in that respect were the early A300's, and FCA's 757's, it didn't matter which, they were all a pain to service.

There are some aspects of ramp operations that I don't miss:E :E

[karrank]

Back to the subject of aircraft smells, I recently had a good look at a Midget Mustang project being continued by a new owner, 25 YEARS after commencement. I was really surprised to cop a big whiff of 'old aeroplane smell' from something that hasn't officially been an aeroplane yet.

Its in the aluminium, and put there by the folks that build it.

[Menen]

From personal experience British aircraft had a different smell to American types. The DC3 leather seats and hydraulic smell was lovely. The Lincoln smell at our squadron was stale BO - from sweaty crews in the tropics of Australia.

The worst smell ever was from an RAF Andover parked in the hangar at Avro's Woodford in Cheshire. It was in there for modifications, having been flown in by a RAF crew. As I was on a current HS748 course at the time, I took the opportunity to hop inside the Andover.

I reeled back at the appalling stink from the rear where the Elsen sat - full of you-know-what - and which had arrived one week ealier in that state. The local union objected and refused to let it's members clean it out. So engineers worked on that aircraft regardless of the smell.

[pulse1]

Presumably the smell is made up of a cocktail of different things. I am sure that the basic smell is of paint, leather and dope. I remember that ATC Cadet and Sedburgh gliders had the same distinctive smell as Chipmunks and the Tiger I learnt to fly in.

[Loose rivets]

Dope, fuel and mostly Sorbo Rubber.


This foam was used in Parker Knoll chairs for years. Not quite the same without the other parts to the cocktail.

After 30 years I stuck my head into an Auster....and the memories came flooding back.

Is it Sawbridgeworth that is shortened to Sorbo. If so, was the product made there?


I got my PPL in Boxted by the way. Percy was the archetypal schoolboy hero. Everything there however smelled of crop-spraying fluid.... the office, the planes the Winco's Astons (plural) and me, after a session in the Tiger.

[Blacksheep]

Irish Steve you should try regularly chucking crushed ice down the vacuum bogs to keep the pipes clear of blockages. Manufacturers do approve of the practice.

Ah yes Menen, Andover bogs - that brings back memories of my days on VVIP operations with the CC MK2 version. Be assured that VVIPs are just the same as we unimportant folks in one respect. The VVIP Elsen was chrome plated but otherwise identical to the economy model; the contents weren't even chrome plated...
A handy young TAG on the squadron carried the things off to the S**t Pit to dump the contents. We called him "Racasan Dan, the sanitary man"

"Never shake hands with a man who has green finger nails".

The thread may have been highjacked somewhat, but it does serve to remind everyone that not all old aeroplanes have that lovely smell - a FEAF Shackleton after a twelve hour patrol would soon shatter all this nostalgia.

[Irish Steve]

Irish Steve you should try regularly chucking crushed ice down the vacuum bogs to keep the pipes clear of blockages. Manufacturers do approve of the practice.

Next time I see the engineer that has to deal with that problem I will pass this on, it might indeed help. Problem is usually a mother that's chucked a disposable nappy in the bog, they are just too darn big and heavy for the vacuum system to shift!!

Thanks

[Menen]

I'm warming to the subject of aircraft smells. I flew the Convair 440 Metropolitan with the VIP squadron in Australia and dumping the toilet at the end of the day at a strange airfield was always a problem.

We solved that by taxying the Convair to the runway and then turning at 90 degrees we would reverse both engines and slowly park the arse end (literally) of the aircraft over the grass with main wheels still on the runway. The engineer would disembark and proceed to the tail where the toilet dump was. He carried a bucket of water. On his signal, we would pressurise the aircraft and select idle reverse. This stopped him getting splashed from the prop slipstream behind the engines.

He would then open the toilet dump valve by means of a short chain and the contents aided by the pressure differential would blurt out on to the grass.

That done, we would depressurise, select idle power and open the front airstairs to pick up the engineer. The agreement was that he would first wash his hands in the bucket of water. That is why over many country airfields in Australia there are nice green patches of grass among the dry dusty dirt.

I thought I would share this little tale with you all...

[treadigraph]

I suppose that provided a darn good reason not to land short...

[TwoDeadDogs]

Nice but weird topic.
Chippies have the smell,to wit; oil(burnt and unburnt),grease, brake fluid,carbon,sweat(especially around the control-column),fabric and dope,fear(probably a mix of pi55 and 5h1t,all topped off with sweat),grass,petrol,soap or deodorant.
Cessnas smell of some of the above and mould and summer-heated plastic.
Cargo planes smell of their freight,especially animals. Aircraft in on a D-check always raise the cry,"Christ! What's that effin' smell?".Airbuses smell of plastic and punters and food squashed into the carpet and whatever has been sacrificed in the oven.
regards
TDD

[Eric Mc]

Hot metal, oil, dope, leather, fuel etc.

It can also be obtained from old cars - Bentleys, pre-war MGs etc.

I own a 1996 Caterham 7 and, after a good spirited run in the countryside, it gives of fan aroma not dissimilar to an aeroplane. It's another reason why I like it so much.

[Blacksheep]

Ah yes, but then a Caterham is an open cockpit aeroplane with the wings and propeller removed so it fits into the garage... ;)

[Paterbrat]

Dak smell most distictive though all old aircraft smell similar. The most wonderful scent. If they could bottle that and sell it at airshows it'd make a mint.

[Eric Mc]

Blacksheep - you're not altogether wrong.

The journal of the Lotus 7 Club is called "Low Flying" - by the way.

[Dan Winterland]

V Bombers had a very evocative smell. Mostly from their wiring and paxolin components. Turns out they contained PCBs! Other odours were present depending on when the pee tube as last cleaned!

JPs smelt of sweat from the parachute pack which doubled as a headrest.

VC10s smelt of the aforementioned racasan, but curry was also usually there along with other stale galley smells.

Chippys - aah, DeHavilland!

[MrBernoulli]

Reminiscing about Victors and VC10s Dan?

How are things going in the Fragrant Harbour? Workin hard on your shiny new jet?

[BEagle]

When I did a little taxying in a Vulcan recently, it certainly had that familiar smell. But as the TRUs were switched on after start, it also had that familiar backround noise on the intercom as well!

We only took the engines up to 80%, so weren't able to generate the Vulcan 'rutting dinosaur' noise!

How's Honkers, Dan?

[Mac the Knife]

Wonderful combination of odours - know it from a Tiger Moth I used to fly in.

Vintage Landrovers have a similar delicious smell. Ahhhhhhh....:ok: