A really big, Vague ask!!!!!!

[El Mirador]

Hello all out there and I wonder if you can help me.
A friend of mine is writing a novel and her hero needs to be a pilot! However the author has some pretty strict criteria and needs some background info.
Basically the 'hero' is around 25 years old and the story is set in the late e1980's/early90's
The 'hero' started at the age of 17/18 with a ppl then went to America to stay with his Uncle and flew a crop sprayer. He then went on to fly Executive jets in America ....How would he accomplish this? He then gained an ATPL in America and then amassed around 2000 hours again how?and what time scale.
He could also have got an ATPL in Britain but again time scales and price would be needed. The eventual goal of the 'hero' is that at the age of 25 he applies for British Airways.
So how did he get to this point at this age?
He has his psychometrics and then a month later has his sims. After his sims how long and how would he be informed of passing? How long after this would he start training with B.A? When does he get his uniform? Where would he train? How much time would he get off? Does he get any weekends off? Where would he stay whilst training? Is this cost met by the airline? What holidays?When would he start to fly passengers as an junior F.O?
I know all this is incredibly vague but you lot are my friend's last hope! We both come from a non aviation background (can you tell???) So any information greatly recieved even if it is just to say that our time scales are impossible/possible!
Remember the novel is set around 10-15 years ago.
Many thanks in advance.

[Rainboe]

Well the Sunday papers are boring, so I will give it a go!
Somewhere between learning to fly and flying bizjets, there would be some other steps. Not to far up on that end of the career, but somewhere there woould be hours building, instructing, crop spraying, CPL course, ATPL then bizjets as co-pilot. He would have been aiming at 'Direct Entry Pilot' (ie not trained by BA- which is unpaid anyway). Late 80s and early 90s saw the end (until the first Gulf War changed it again) of a dearth of new entrant pilots into BA. Very few came in from mid 80s onwards. There were some new entrants by '89. The selection process gave a sim ride as part of the weeding out process. Then a Holding Pool until summonsed. At induction, pay starts on basic, uniform supplied, induction courses completed, technical course (preference expressed, but you go wherever and whatever posted to) at Cranebank (east LHR) onto whatever posted on followed by simulator training (about 16 sessions for new entrants). Sims run from 0600-2300 daily every day, 1 hr briefing, 4 hours in the box with coffee break, 1/2 debrief. Not more than a day between sessions, Safety Equipment Procedures (couple of days). Masses of work, not enough time, loads of manuals to read. Get yer own accommodation, so support provided. Leave- you must be joking- all conversion work takes priority. Now that zero flight time sims are a fact (ie good enough to substitute real thing flying circuits), he will next be rostered trips with Training Captain- probably about 30 or so with a real co-pilot sitting in supernumary seat until issued with Operations Certificate. Then be 'brown lined' to make sure he doesn't fly with a newly promoted or converted Captain for 3 months. Then he will be out on his own, expected to be 100% effective, able to do full Category 3 autolands in bad weather and handle all normal problems downroute. I converted with a new entrant in 1989 who went on to be a Concorde copilot and is now a 747-400 Captain

[El Mirador]

You complete and utter star!!!! Thanks for bothering to answer. Can't tell you how much I appreciate it. If the book ever gets off the ground I will insist she comes and finds you!:O

[booklover]

Hello Rainboe
Thank you so much for your help, (potential authoress here, having been told by my freind to now do my own dirty work, and shown how) I wonder , could you possibly clarify for me a few points in your reply? (Please don't feel at all obliged as you have been incredibly helpful already and I guess the newspapers arn't alwasys boring.)
1) could you give 1 or 2 examples of a posting from Cranebank and of the subsequent "posting onto"
2) In weeks, approx how long till the 16 sessions of sims is over?
3)During the 30 or so rosterred trips with the training captain, is the trainee called a co-pilot? (how many of you are in the cock-pit ? ) Is this a very busy period too or are there chances for days off inbetween trips.
4)After the 3mths brownlined, i.e when you are expected to be 100% effective (gosh,!!!! by the way,) what do you become... a captain?)
5)Whats the diff between a newly promoted & a converted captain?
6)As a former co-pilot in concorde (wow, by the way!) you are a little too brilliant for my books hero, (who is actually a character involved with the heroin) what would be more typical?
I shan't bother you ever again...and thanks so much for being such a...hero.
From the booklover

[Rainboe]

On induction into the Company, you are told what base and what fleet you will be posted to. You then do the induction courses learning about the company and how to stand and salute whenever anybody mentions 'Waterside', 'Robert Ayling' or 'allowances'. Then get Safety Equipment Procedures out of the way- leaping into liferafts in swimming baths and scaring children away (I do that anyway), firing extinguishers, donning smoke hoods and finding M & Ms in a smoky cabin. Then the high pressure technical course on the aeroplane- about 10 days learning systems followed by a licence exam, then simulators. I think there are about 16 for new entrants to learn the right way to operate a jet aeroplane and handle all the emergencies, engine out etc.. Then line flying for about 30 flights with a Training Captain and a fully qualified safety pilot learning the ropes. Eventually the 3rd pilot, the safety pilot is dispensed with and just the Training Captain needs to be satisfied that the trainee is ready to fly the line. Then that pilot is rostered with Captains who are not new on the aeroplane themselves. At this stage he should be a useful member of the community able to handle a lot of situations, but still gaining experience. It'll be 2 years before he is 100%- less on shorthaul flying because of the large number of flights they do there. Rosters will be about 6 days on/2 days off with occasionally 3 or 4 days off- usually 8-10 days off a month, with work days stretching anytime from 6 am to 10pm, length limited by number of flights. Longhaul pilots always have at least a day between flights as they usually involve night flights out and/or home and are more tiring. The social life is better and visiting new places fun- altogether a far better existence, but averaging about 3 or 4 flights a week, it takes longer to get cleared.

The simulators will take the best part of 4 weeks to get through I think with a tremendous amount of manuals to be read and sessions to prepare for.

Forget becoming a Captain- that will take years and years- you join the seniority list on joining and maintain your position as people fall off the top and retire. Some Captains get promoted on type- some bid to go to another type and become a Captain- usually involving a step down to a less convenient aeroplane to get an earlier promotion. That's called a conversion. Sometimes, pilots bid to convert to another type without promotion- more prestigious fleets like the 747 (God Bless Her). If they are really unlucky, they get the 777 which only has 2 engines (let's not go into that now). I didn't fly Concorde- too damn fast for me. I enjoy getting there.

All this is what I remember it used to be like. I'm not very up to date, and it's not a startling conversion piece in bars, so it may be different now. People are so relieved to get out of the induction/training process they don't really want to relive it unless you make them.

[booklover]

:{ Hello Again
Gosh, your reply was quick. Its pretty complicated stuff, (and thats without doing it!) You,ve certainly provided me with enough to make my hero seem plausible. Thank you for reliving such a tough time...and the out of date factor is perfect as the story starts in the late 80's. Out of curiosity, may I ask what you fly/flew?(not that it will mean an awful lot to me, but I gather 747's are pretty cool....so would appreciate a generally aknowledged "cool scale" figure out of 10....if you arn't too busy.
Well, Thanks again....and no frightening small children! ( I remember once being one.)

[Rainboe]

Booklover- a word of advice. Never ever ask a pilot what he flew (unless you want a very boring evening in nodding your head). Each pilot will answer 'he flew the best'. Well I was fortunate enough to really do it whereas all the others were pretending. I flew that Queen of the Skies, the ultimate in British aviation, the VC10 ('sound of fanfare' Some people call it the 'Iron Duck' as it was apparently carved out of solid stainless steel and as strong as a bus, but they are just common). Wicked. Any pilot that didn't want to fly either Concorde or the 747 has got to be something missing (widebody or supersonic experience). I did the 747- another Queen of the Skies. On the way, I took a wrong turn and went up a shorthaul cul de sac flying B737 which was not me at all- something about all that flying and ending up back where you started- I like a cool hotel room far from squawking babies. Back on the B747, but the GTi version (with FOUR engines, but rarely now and again 3) to see the time out flying to exotic hotspots (like Philadelphia).
Much as it seems arrogant, a wonderful career that I am exceedingly grateful for- there is not much I would have changed (except the time with the unfortunate KLM stewardess in Nairobi, but they are a bunch of absolute party nutters anyway and shouldn't be let loose on other crews.)

[booklover]

Rainboe, you flew some lovely one's! I imagine there was some pretty stiff competition for the planes you flew...you must be awfully good.
My sister explained them to me...she hangs with a few fly-boy types herself...not that they were as helpful as you, they only told her some of the latest stuff, and nowhere near as detailed.
As for the nairobi party nutters...way to go....!!!( Although, my heroine's hero shan't be "partying".....well, at least not at first, he'll be far too busy with Simms, poor chap...I'd love to tap you for all these little details, but the pilot chap will be replaced by another character eventually. I can't decide yet whether he'll return....I do like him ....she may even marry him....but not if he's caught partying....obviously.
I wanted to ask why you are called Rainboe....but thats really REALLY my last question... (unless I do marry off the heroin to the dashing pilot...poor you, thats a warning to lie low!) Anyway, I must get on...or I'll never get this blessed novel done.
bye-bye, and thank-you very much, by the way!
booklover

[Rainboe]

'As you asked, 'Rainboe' is a repellent, so toxic it has been banned! I thought that was an apt a description. It was actually a rain repellent for Boeings ('boe'). It was stored on the flight deck like car windscreen washer, then it was discovered it was so nerve toxic and nasty, that was the last place it should ever be! It has been removed, and funnily enough it is now apparent it was never needed in the first place.

I wish I was awfully good! I just managed to kid people for long enough I was a reasonable pilot! I've managed not to kill anyone so far.......but I'm working on it!

[booklover]

;) Well, I don't believe you are at all nasty, toxic or otherwise and shall regard you more in a bright and colourful sort of a light.
Thanks again for all your help.
Booklover

[Onan the Clumsy]

Why would you write a book about someone like that? 25 years old, 2000 hours and he gets a job with BA.

I already hate him and you haven't even written the book.

It might only be jealousy on my part, but can't you at least give him a fatal flaw like an inappropriate attraction to young boys or at the very least an irritating skin condition?


:(

[booklover]

: ; )

Hello Onan,
(I,m sure you're not clumsy). Don't be jealouse, the poor guy gets such a hard time from the heroine, and through no fault of his own...(or hers to be fair.) However, your suggestions made me laugh! There are one or two other characters who certainly deserve such flaws!
(I,m very scatty about checking this forum thing for replies. My freind who introduced me to the site tends to tell me I have a reply, but I've been away for a week. We are off again for the rest of Easter after the bank holiday...so if you reply and I don't respond for a while, please don't think ME up a flaw ....besides, I,m flawless! Except for my inability to spell, (kind of a drawback for a writer.)

From Booklover

NB Note to my freind; "Flawless" in the more general sense of the term.