"Australian Flying" and PPRune

[Sunfish]

Last page of Australian Flying(March/april 2005) is an interesting read. PPrune seems to have scored a mention without being mentioned - and not in a particularly good light.

[dude65]

Give us a bit of a hint please Sunfish

[AerocatS2A]

I suppose that if I had Australian Flying I'd know what the hell you're talking about.

[VH-Cheer Up]

Check yr PMs Sunfish

[blueloo]

It is a pretty average magazine anyway, so who cares!

[Otto2]

I like Australian Flying.
Compared to other aviation mags I prefer its private flying/GA bent.
If you don’t like it don’t buy it. Bet you still browse through it at the newsagent though

[Sunfish]

I like Australian Flying.

The article is Paul Phelan's "Backlash" Column. Headed "Transparent Malice"

In it he wonders why Aviation is seen as a brotherhood elsewhere on earth but in AUstralia people are constantly sticking knives in each others backs.

He appears to be saying we knock people and organisations unmercifully. Then he mentions PPrune:

"Anonymous venom donors on a well known aviation website, (could only be PPrune:p) lurking pathetically behind the precarious anonymity the site offers"

These people target organisations and institutions "with the effect and possible intent" of damaging them.

The implication to me is that he sees many PPrune comments are defamatory (despite the woomerii) and so on

He then gives an example of a pilot who inadvertantly or deliberately let his PPrune nickname be known at a job interviw with the result according to Mr. Phelan, that the individual concerned was not only not employed, but his name was placed on a blacklist "shared by several organisations to protect them from inadvertantly hiring unsuitable people." (something to do with using the term meatbombers).

The obvious implication is that just because a person is outspoken on the internet, they must therefore be mentally unstable.

Now little Sunfish doesn't see the obvious connection here...Most people are outspoken on the internet precisely because it is anonymous, therefore the old internal censor is not at work and they let rip.

Well Mr. Phelan, I'm reading the war Diaries of Lord Alan Brooke, CIGS in WWII. You want to hear scathing language about Churchill? Eisenhower? And many others? Did that make him mentally unstable?

Furthermore by playing the "defamation" card, in respect of the internet, you are simply playing into the hands of the big end of town. Defamation laws are only of use to the rich and powerful - and are generally used to suppress their misdeeds.

To my way of thinking, the internet has brought a refreshing dimension to the world. We now have a global playing field where it is very difficult to hide public misdeeds. For an example, visit www.groklaw.net which is a website devoted to uncovering the dirty tricks of Microsoft and others in their efforts to kill open source software.

I would have thought that "trolling through the murk" (as he calls it) might be more rewarding for a regulator than reading press releases.

The rest of the article covers the phenomenon of what used to be called "murder by memo" the practice of making unsubstantiated allegations against businesses and alludes to CASA's travails in this respect.

If you want the rest, buy the magazine.

[Buster Hyman]

Well, I don't read his mag & have no intention, but could forums like this be affecting his circulation? I guarantee you'll find more info...yes, and rubbish...on this site than you'll get in his mag.

Magazines like his are glossy & expensive one way forums. His opinion is as equal to anyone elses, only here, we can rebuke idiots.

[gaunty]

Sunfish what can I say :ok:

Buster

Magazines like his are glossy & expensive one way forums. His opinion is as equal to anyone elses, only here, we can rebuke idiots. game set and match, thank you linesmen thank you ball boys.:p

PPRuNe D & G subscribers and viewers (= subscribers by about 4) are numbers that the publishers of the mag can only dream of.:zzz: and that's not including the international "visits".

[QSK?]

I don't like "Australian Flying" and won't buy it.

Too many what a lovely day we had the day we went to Bangor type articles for my liking, and also not enough articles focussing on the needs of the more advanced pilots.

Also I was absolutely amazed the magazine virtually ignored the debate on NAS, with the editor even admitting in an editorial she didn't think it was worth commenting on!

I certainly can't imagine the US aviation publications taking the same approach to such an important issue like airspace reform.

There is truly a need for an aviation magazine in Australia that addresses the more serious side of aviation. Anybody?

Until then, I guess I'll continue my subscriptions to OS flying mags.

[Horatio Leafblower]

Real-world flying written by real pilots with enormous operational experience. Yeah they get to have a lov-el-y day in bangor, too, but usually it's in a GIV, B-25, Liberator or some other bit of gear we'd all like to fly.

They review some great gear and modern aeroplanes, conduct serious analysis of used aircraft markets, and set the bar higher, giving its readers something to aspire to.

B/CA even better.

Landing a C182 at Katoomba is about the most exciting thing Aus Flying has ever done...

Then of course we could compare "their" AOPA magazine with "our" AOPA magazine, but that's a different topic. :ouch:

That said I think Mr Phelean's comments (if not his own vitriol) have some merit, not only on this site (where he at least posts under his own name) but especially in relation to AGACF. :yuk:

The hate there makes PPRuNe look like Sunday School.

Cheers

[Woomera]

"The hate there makes PPRuNe look like Sunday School."

:} :}

Ahhh, but it's the superior, unbiased, competent, fair, reasonable, tallented, Moderating on PPRuNe that counts!!

:E

Woomera


P.S. Betcha this post gets copied to that other site within a few hours......... :p

[bigfella5]

mmmmmmmmmmm............I seem to recall an article done by that editor that ran along the lines of..."air traffic controllers holding the poor little private pilot to ransom....the arrogance of the typical commercial pilot in poo pooing the Dicky boy Smith NAS proposal et al. So where does that editorial sit with ......These people target organisations and institutions "with the effect and possible intent" of damaging them.?

Me thinks that he should stay in Cairns, keep flying his little plane (I'm sure I saw the same aircraft on "Noddys on his way" and leave intelligent commenting on subjects aviation to the professionals.
Rant endeth here....nurse, more beer please:E

[Sunfish]

Frankly, I like "Australian Flying" because its articles are relevent to a beginner like me. There is usually at least one article that tells me something useful I didn't know.

There is another magazine which I find a waste of time because it seems to be pandering to spotters. I'm not interested in the latest fashion interiors of corporate jets, or the fact that some Boeing B777 has a GE708xppydddash15 engine. Nor do I wish to know that aerowhatistname has just taken delivery of a brand new Pilatus registered VH XYZ.

[Atlas Shrugged]

I've yet to read anything constructive written by Phelan, other than an occasional training article. I would even go as far as to put his Backlash Column in the same category as the DS Flyer & Bindook.com

http://talk.thebabycorner.com/images/smilies/toilet2.gif

On the positive side, Jim Davis' articles are the only worthy parts of the magazine.

A

[Sunfish]

JD's stuff is very useful. Wonder When Jim Davis's book will come out?

[Lasiorhinus]

Australian Flying is an excellent magazine very relevant to the typical private pilot. Hearing about people flying to wherever for lunch is a lot more relevant to me when they're doing it in a 172 as opposed to the americans who just happen to have a KingAir in the shed for weekend trips.
Australian Aviation isnt a particularly bad read, but it does have far too much info that for me isnt relevant - airline and military stuff - so that particular magazine gets a flip at the newsagent (particularly 'Tales') but I spend my money on Aus Flying and US Flying.
Yes, thats right, TWO magazines.
Why limit yourself to the one you see as the best, when its easy enough to buy a couple and get the best of both worlds!
(plus, the yankee one comes out twice as often)

[Spodman]

"Landing a C182 at Katoomba is about the most exciting thing Aus Flying has ever done..."

Sounds marvellous to me, it is something to which I aspire. Septic Flying's articles charging IFR off into cr@p weather is something off in the unlikely future for me. I like reading about real, basic flying.

Phelan's bits are not my favourite.

[QSK?]

Hello Spodman:

Check ya PMs!

[Frank Burden]

Isn't it simply a matter of horses for courses?

The editorial policy seeks to find the right mix for the target market group. No one publication will please everyone. Australian Flying is great for its target audience but those with more experience may pefer more technically based reading.

Look at some of the really popular magazines on the newstand. Very much aimed at people who have little disposable income but are happy to spend the few dollars that they have on perverse enjoyment watching over the shoulders of the rich and famous. How many will have Mary on the front cover this week?

[Alternator]

I think Australian Flying is a good 'bottom range' mag.

The US versions are a little too IFR (even though I am IFR there is a limit to how much I can read on winter storms over Kansas).

Aust AOPA is too political.

But the point of this thread, well there is a lot of nasty stuff that goes on here, perhaps unfair to lable everyone, but you have to admit Phelan has a point.

As for the guy who didn't get a job at Barwon, bwahahahahahahahahahahahah :D

[Sid Departure]

Sunfish, your second post on this subject is excellent. As for buying the magazine, I'll pass, the Wallpaper magazine is far more interesting! ;)

[VRB03KT CAVOK]

How come nobody has mentioned Flight Safety Australia?

I buy Australian Flying but spend more time reading the ATSB's bi-monthly freebie...

A few good articles in each magazine that give some really useful advice.

[dude65]

Agreed CAVOK

The latest edition has a couple of CD's explaining the approach and departure proceedures for various GA airfields around the country. Very well done with plenty of shots from inside the aircraft on what approach points to look for. Very handy to be able to know what your looking for before you even get in the aircraft.

For VFR blokes like me it will make things that little bit easier.

[Chadzat]

I totally agree that Flight Safety is a good read, as a pilot in training some of the "learn from others mistakes" are invaluable. Its just a shame I get it near the end of the published period! Ie for a Jan-Feb Flight Safety I may get it in the second last week of febuary...does this happen to other people!?

On another note, this is my first post on this damn big forum so hi everyone! I think I'll keep my nose in this section of the forum otherwise it may get broken rather quickly by the 'big wig' airliner jocks. From what I have read their pay packets have gone to their head, which itself has conveniently migrated to their rear end. :rolleyes:

Chad

[Icarus2001]

VRB03KT CAVOKHow come nobody has mentioned Flight Safety Australia?I buy Australian Flying but spend more time reading the ATSB's bi-monthly freebie...
Obviously not enough time as Flight Safety Australia is published by CASAs Safety Promotion Unit.

[7gcbc]

I agree also with CAVOK, I occasionally buy "Aus Flying" but find I'm finished with it in about 30 mins, the Flight Safety mag has much more interestng stuff, and excellent quizes, or quizzeses ?

[SkySista]

Couldn't believe FSA was free when I first got it... does anyone else remeber the blue-and-white Aiming Higher...? Had a gap between that and FSA... only got FSA about halfway thru last year... no idea why. Do they charge for back issues?

Sometimes buy Aus Flying but only if there's a particularly good read in there... I did enjoy that article they had a while back about that forced landings course over East.... and the one about inflight solutions to problems like mixed-up cables, blocked pitot tube etc....

Knew right away they meant Pprune.. and agree... there is an awful lot of bitching on this forum, though mostly people are kind and helpful. I wondered myself why it seems in Aus the av community is so.... (for lack of a better term) bitchy/catty

(though of course excepting all those lovely people i have met in the last few years... tp blokes and gals with lots of advice and always willing to help :ok:

Sky

[NAMPS]

Skysista

You can access the back issues of FSA on the net here (http://www.casa.gov.au/fsa/index.htm)

They have back issues to 1996 when it was bi-annual.

[Sunfish]

FS is always a good read. I keep wondering if the number of pages are an indication of CASA's health. It seems to be getting a little thicker.

I like their new website too.

[Avgas172]

G'Day, My two cents worth = I enjoy the mag (Aust Flying)been reading it for years, Phelans articles are of some merit most of the time but Jim Davis is always a good read, in this issue he has a good article on Coanda vs Bernoulli, my worry is that they (the editors) don't get too caught up in the Lite Sport a/c thing and stick to GA (with the odd report on very small flying contraptions)as the RAA mag covers that field quite adequately.
If they do I'll be off to the states to subscribe to Flying and the rantings of Collins, Garrison and lovely Lane Wallace (a cutie),
I must confess that I get it at the Newsagents now as well as Aust Flying.... and on a last note my fellow ppruners lets face it we can be a tad vitriollic at times :E

[Atlas Shrugged]

USA Flying, why buy it. Go here:

http://www.flyingmag.com/

A

[Avgas172]

Ta for that Mr Shrugs.... takes a while to download though and I still prefer the feel of the real thing whilst lying back in my air conditioned cab, nevertheless is pretty handy when I'm at home and a bit more up to date than the newsagents out here in the bush. ;)

[poteroo]

Incentive to Go Flying

If there's one thing that GA needs to promote- it's how to get value out of your PPL/AUF/SPL etc. The industry needs hours to be flown, aircraft to be built or bought, and the networking to be wide.

Good stories on places to go, trips to take, skill upgrades to think about, new aircraft types, new avionics, and new pilot gear, are of real interest to pilots - and AF does this pretty well.

The demographic that's served well by AF is not the bizjet/RPT/IFR end of the industry - there are other mags which do that very well.

We all need to think back to our early flying days, and remember how avidly we read anything on aviation. We used to think it was exciting stuff, even tho it was probably ho hum to the upper ranks of the day.

Todays dreamers are tomorrows market

happy days,