Please feel free to post things here re above but dont mention the war.

You Gotta love Someone with a sense of humour!!!

ROFLOL..............:D

Rumour has it that QF dont have enough crew moving to LHR for the proposed LHR base with enough experience for CSM positions.

QF's answer?

Train the Thai crew.

It seems those moving to LHR will be operating with/for Thai based CSMs.

They will be operating to LHR and slipping before returning south.

Perhaps a change in name is in order for the rat.

Qanthai might work?

jettlager

There is no way that Qf will be training Thai crew as CSM's. There is ample numbers of current Australian based crew to fill the onboard manager positions, both CSM and CSS.

This information is from an extemely reliable {ie company } source.

I can just hear it now........Sawadee kaaaaaaaaaa.

Jettlager

If it wasn`t so serious this whole silly saga would be the best soap opera on the internet.
The lengths of absolute stupidity that the management(?)of Qantas will go to is beyond belief.Actually I should qualify that...they are believable.The idea that Qantas aspires to the best airline in the world must now be surely dead and buried.It has become a third rate bus company with fifth rate twits running the show.A once proud tradition of service,safety,hospitality and employee empowerment is sadly over.
Virgin Airlines is gathering steam and the motivation and empowerment that Branson provides his staff is a joy to behold.Branson knows that you require happy motivated staff and that they require the resources to do their job.Qantas has neither.

Butterfield8,

you are so tragically right.

lettlager

Don't forget also that your comments may offend current crew also-most crew still deliver outstanding service and hospitality experienced nowhere else, it just adapts to the current situations. I don't think that crew aren't delivering the fantastic service that was once delivered, i just think that maybe new procedures etc and all that stuff maybe limits the way crew deliver it. Many crew have many different opinions.

Oz

I think many crew(including myself) have become robots,doing the service by numbers to save their sanity from the ridiculous procedures.Whilst the service I offer is good,it is no longer excellent.The time constraints(caused by lack of manpower and the convoluted meal services) and the lack of resources(as mentioned above)just don`t allow for superior quality of hospitality.I apologize or say no we don`t have it more often now than at any other time in my 17 years of flying.I really do feel sorry for the passengers.
The new LHR Base is going to take at least 12 months(if not more)to come up to speed.A general lack of experience is going to cause havoc.The passengers get screwed again.

Cmon guys.. really :mad:

The Moderators shut down the London Base Forum, and now another boring "lets slag the company" one opens again..Frankly im tired of it.. it goes no where.

Regarding Thai based CSM's.. where is everyones common sense? Those of you that have been around long enough will know that only PERMANENT FULL TIME "QANTAS" Flight Attendants can apply for CSM positions. We all know that the THAI based crew are contracted, along with the NZ base etc.

If anyone posts in future, be factual, no more drama.
Im over it :*

Bodum
Don`t like it: Don`t read it:confused:

747Maverick

You are wrong and a quick check of "factual" information as suggested by Bodum confirms this below. Maybe they cant retain the position on a permanent basis as stated by Bodum but then again why not if Cabin Crew UK can do it why not Addeco Bangkok?

The following is part of a newsletter dated 19/10/04 from www.faaa.net

We have already been advised that the company has commenced “contingency” upgrade training of some of the BKK based crew in CSM duties. When asked why the BKK based crew and not Australian based crew are being trained the answer was “it's the way the company is planning to handle sick leave and unexpected situations”. The Auckland based crew however, have not been offered this training.

Galleyhag i wouldn't belive everything the FAAA prints and says. In one of their newsletters they also said that if you took the basing you 'MAY' not retain your seniority - well this is false. If you did take the position through LWOP you still retain it. The union is trying everything in their power to prevent it happening, which is fine. They just sometimes stretch the truth and word things stategically - the same as the company does.

747Maverick,

the information confirming that the Thais would be trained as CSMs to operate with the LHR base crew came from the individual who was offered, but has since declined, the Base Managers position in the UK.

Steven Reed confirmed that QF have stated that they wish to promote overseas base crew.

Given the FAAA will have no control/influence on conditions relating to flying out of the UK it seems that QF [in their wisdom?] are free to do as they wish.

Sawadee Kaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Jettlager

2 November 2004

Attention All Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants

EBA VII – IN PRINCIPLE AGREEMENT REACHED WITH QANTAS
We are pleased to advise all Flight Attendants that an “In Principle Agreement” on EBAVII has been reached with Qantas.

With the assistance of Commissioner Raffaelli, of the Australian Industrial Relations Commission, a memorandum of understanding between Qantas and the FAAA was signed today 2 nd November 2004.

The full details of the agreement will be sent to all Flight Attendants. It is our intention to hold a series of meetings throughout Australia and other International Slip ports to provide crew with a comprehensive briefing prior to the postal ballot.

A summary of the agreement is as follows:-

A 3% per annum pay increase for each of the 3 years of the EBA.

The removal of the Pay Equalisation review clause from the last EBA that could have resulted in a pay cut.

The removal of the roster review clause from the last EBA that could have resulted in changes to the seniority based preferential bid system.

A new Divisional Flying Agreement with Qantas the FAAA (Domestic and International Divisions) that provides for the Commission to conciliate, and in the event that the conciliation is not successful, for private arbitration by the Commission of any disputes . The Agreement locks in the 747 and A380 exclusively for long haul and provides access to the A330, and provision for consultation on new aircraft.

One Flight per day for Australian based crews to London . This will not be date limited.

A new leave bank agreement subject to the approval of the OEA. ( Office of Employment Advocate)
The ability to change your nominated travel beneficiaries every 6 months and one free ticket at your travel category to be used during the life of the EBA for a trip to London in recognition of the London Base effect. This is for the flight attendant or one nominated travel beneficiary.

Changes to the Language Lines for new flight attendants with Cantonese, Mandarin and Hindi Languages.

A Cap on overseas based crew. This cap does not have an expiry date like the current EBA and continues for the life of the Agreement.
We have received assurances from the Company that the flight attendants employed on 11 month fixed term contracts will be considered for other positions within the Qantas Group when their contract expires.
The FAAA strongly recommends the in principle agreement to cabin crew as a good deal that overwhelmingly achieves the objectives that we have communicated to you. This was achieved without having to engage in protracted industrial action.

Finally, we do not believe that this agreement would have been possible without the very public support and solidarity of our membership. We are very proud and grateful for the support that you have given us.

Written by Steven Reed – President International Division
And authorised by Michael Mijatov – Secretary International Division

It appears a sensible outcome has been achieved despite all Dixon`s posturing.Well done the negotiating team at the FAAA!!

Just released by Qantas through the ASX that EBA negotiations have concluded, negating the requirement for strikebreakers over Christmas

great news ! phewwwww


so where does this leave our strike breaking friends ?

Up a certain creek, paddleless, I'd imagine. Still remains a contemptable act by QF to use people like that. There is still opportunity for the rat managers to redeem themselves in this area.......
A Cap on overseas based crew That's a very broad 'principle'.

It would be good if the agreement covered on-going access to the LHR base for Australian LH crew after the initial 2 years for the crew that have taken up the positions. I dont agree with the opening of the LHR base, however I feel Australian based crew should always get first preference over UK nationals now that the agreement has been reached.

str et al, what say you now soothsayers? Maybe you can leave federal politics out of this now and give Johnny a break? It appears sanity does beat bullsh!t after all.:rolleyes:

54% of the eligible electorate did not vote for the "great deceiver".It was commonsense that prevailed here.Politics had nothing to do with it

When do these 11 month fixed term contracts expire, have they only just started or have they been going for 6 months already? What do you think are QF's intentions with them once the contract expires? Is there a real chance of permanency for them or just an extension of their contracts? Is there an agreement in L/H they says they can only be on a contract for a certain amount of time before having to be made permanent or can it just be continuously extended? Just curious.

Oz

Well, well, well.... Who has been paid off!

The sellout sisters have delivered an astonishing blow to QF long haul cabin crew. Not only have they now ALLOWED the LHR base to go ahead but they have accepted a measly 3% per annum pay increase for it.

What the hell is going on when execs and directors can pick up 66% pay rises for slash and burn tactics at the coalface and the most affected party gets 3%. Shame on you!

The union finally had the upper hand. Had QF suffering through the hip pocket. Christmas bookings were hurting and what did the union do? Did a crap deal that's what. But wait there's more, crew get a free ticket to London as compensation for loosing all but one a day trips to LHR. What about the overtime and allowances I will loose? What about the 3% we gave up during the pay freeze?

Well that's the last subscription the union will get from me. They have sold us out. All that rhetoric about stopping the base from going ahead and "we will not give in this time".

To the union officials: You got elected to office for claims you would be strong. well I reckon someone has paid you off - how much was our sacrifice worth......?????

The LHR base has been mulled over and chewed over for 7 months on various forums and still it surprises that people are still not that knowledgeable.
FACT:the base was going ahead because the cap on overseas bases was due to expire on 17/12/04.It was part of EBA6 and was voted up by 53% of longhaul crew.Last year was the time to be upset not now.
The outcome under the circumstances appears to be fairly agreeable.Unionism is in its death throes in this country.Big business with the aid of little Johnny is going to reign supreme.
If you don`t like the FAAA, membership is not compulsory.Employment at QF is likewise not compulsory.Considering the FAAA executive was dealt a poor hand by their predecessors the outcome is agrreeable
I am left of centre as far as political persuasion is concerned and some of the people on the FAAA are friends.Let me assure that they would sellout ot no-one.I would be the first to scream at them if they had backed down.The whole issue was never about money but protecting and maintaining conditions.

Hi there

I went to an ass cntr in Sydney 3sep04. Have ground crew experience with a major international carrier close to 10yrs. I speak 4 languages one of them priority.
Had references checked just a few days ago and QF seemed to be in no rush.
What do you guys think they have in mind. Now, when an agreement has been reached between FAAA and QF do you think that QF will take on the 350 "strikebreaking crew" on new longer contracts or will they still employ staff like myself? I am worried that QF will put on a staff freeze, btw went for longhaul!! Anybody with any info????
Thanx

Hi Petriboy

My understanding from various media releases and news articles says that you won't be kept on, in any form, at QF.

The only contractors QF are looking at keeping when the time comes are those that are currently performing their 11 month contracts. Even then, the news releases are saying that positions will be found for them (as applicable) within the Qantas Group - so, essentially, you may not even remain in Long Haul.

They have enough of their own ground staff on 11-month secondments, plus external staff in the middle of their 11-month contracts, not to warrant additional recruitment (with the exception of LHR base of course).

Sorry to burst your bubble.

Not wanting to stand on my soapbox and preach, but what I am about to say is aimed only at the small number of individuals (not you necessarily petriboy) who knew they were entering into strikebreaking when they took on the 3-month contract:

Ye reap as ye sow.

it looks like the faaa has again done a very dudd deal caving in to qantas. after month of jumping up and down they got a pad on the shoulder told to shut up and now the membership should approve another lousy deal. all i can say is No,NO,NO

Well thats a grand total of THREE who aren`t happy.Go to LHR a lot do we?Well you will still be able to go to THE CHURCH on Sunday.

Hi Petriboy
QF don't even know what they are doing on a daily basis with their crew.All the strikebreakers will be let go ...who wants to work with them anyways...they were given a 3 month contract & when they started traing they were told that it was a 1 month contract.
LH just had a few SH go over & so everyone is waitng with bated breath on progression from regional to SH.Working in the regionals is the only way to go as they are FULL TIME Permanent..with crap pay.You might have to wait upto 4.5 years to go over to Sh (Like I and many others did)..
Good luck out there:D

I am just in limbo...........I never wanted to be a strikebreaker/scab.
I have always wanted to fly and had the opportunity to attend the ass cntr in syd on 3sep04.
I did not even know about the upcoming planned strike. QF advised that they were needing xtra staff for the busy xmas period. I asked if these "upto 11-month contracts"could be extended and the answear from the HR bird was" I cant see why QF would spend all the money and time to train new flt attendants if there wouldnt be a vision"
So now as the strike is over and I had my references checked just a few days ago, is there anybody who is in the same situation? Why would they check my references now when QF knows that the strike is off. I was never contacted until NOW!!!

As i said b4 i speak 4 languages and airline experience 10yrs (ground crew).. Are they planning to hire more crew?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

hi all you guys who have been played a miserable card by qf management. unfortunatly you will not know where you end up or if you get a permanent position. as usual they give you beautiful words with a big Q mark behind. the rest of longhaul have just been offered any leave before and after christmas as once again qf has got its crewing numbers wrong.nothing changed in the years i have been around. just a piece of advise , before you guys take up any position in auckland (lousy pay) or U.K (as bad as) try any local subsideries as they offer the only chance ( to my knowledge i have not heard of any auckland or bangkok base transferring to sydney) to get into mainstram qf on a longterm basis. good luck

the strike is officiially off but the EBA needs to be approved by the membership first. so qf management will string you guys out a little longer just in case the EBA gets knocked back

So now people in other subsidiaries of Qantas have to work with the strike breakers ?

I am very confused as to why the treatment is so good for these new recruits.

There were many people on the Qantas shortlist for over 18 months who only a few months ago got their final letter from QF advising them that their shortlist period will not be renewed and therefore were "dumped" by QF. Yet these people who trained as strikebreakers are now going to get offerred jobs in other Qantas group companies ? ( I might also add that these strikebreakers did not even go through the lenghty recruitment process that the 18month shortlisters did .) Shouldn't it have been the people on the shortlist for over 18months who were looked after considerably better and offerred alternate positions.

Ridiculous.:\ :\

Hi!!!

I was one of those people on the shortlist for nearly 18 months, i was luckily offered a casual position nearly a year ago, however a point i needed to raise. We didn't go through the same recruitment process as the 3 month contractors. No offence to them, we had a group interview where they were interviewing 100 people a day for a week, then we had to have a phone interview for ten minutes and after that we had to have a panel interview which took about half an hour, all within a month, something similar to what most people went through throughout the years, once all of that was done we had a medical and then waited 7 weeks to find out if we were on the shortlist.

Speaking to someone that recruits and also recruits interviewers, the recruitment process over the last year or two has become a lot easier and from when we went through interviews, the questions and process during interviews has changed completely again. So infact the process was different, maybe similar in ways, but it was different and a lot longer!

Not annoyed, just needed to put it straight.
Good luck to everyone who is waiting or doesn't know what's going on at all!

Oz
:ok:

I and a number of other people i know went to the group assesment, panel interview then medical and security check. As far as i'm aware this has always been the recruitment process or similar. I don't think the interviews were easy at all, i've been to panel interview with QF about 2 or 3 years ago and i think the one I had for fixed term was much harder.

I started the process back in July and it took about 8 weeks, maybe after that the decided to change the process and make it shorter i don't know.

Anyway does it really matter??

Tell you the truth i'm sick of the whole bloody thing.

ah, c'mon guys - do you reckon there is any chance the moderators might let L2P on line just for one more spray -there are so many of us out here who would love to hear the slant he would put on this EBA outcome......
he was cut off a few days short
c'mon L2P we know you're lurking out there somewhere full of righteous indignation and rage at this ostensible sell out by your union mates - morph into someone else - let us hear those dulcet tones!!
(I've never seen a person implode in cyber space.......)

Huge Grunt makes one of his/her infrequent visits.....I believe L2P may have been reincarnated as qfcsm...not sure but,maybe.

Hi Midnight-63

How soon can 3 month contractors (with the right passport etc) start applying for the LHR base positions?

If the LHR base positions are for 2 years (I believe, open to correction) then do the contractors return to positions in AUS when finished or will they be placed back on to a waitlist again for AUS based positions?

Good luck - looks like there might be many possibilities for you all, just have to see which QF group airline next requires people.

just finished reading the Qantas Cabin Crew(UK) work rules
don't like the bit about "Nothing shall prevent QANTAS from contacting an employee on a day off and , if operationally necessary, requiring them to sign -on for a duty within a reasonable period of time but no longer than two hours."

But otherwise, everything else looks pretty ridgedy- didge.

I guess its a case of don't answer the phone in London.

ps...stylistically speaking, I don\'t think qfcsm is L2P -not enough mongrel and saliva in the posting .......

You MUST be contactable.As they they do here, they will send a cab or someone.240 hours .....find yourself a sympathetic Doctor....Maybe Q Tee can recommend one.You forgot about cross crewing.Boy is that gonna hurt!!!
Maybe jettlager is our old friend Left 2 Primary.

Thanks for the replies Midnight and Biscuit.

I didn't hear from QF re 3 month contract work so I am just waiting (hopefully) for future recruitment or at least other ways that I can get into QF (MAM, regionals etc).

Sounds promising re. Mandarin speakers

Cheers:ok:

i like it when hugh reckons its all right to do 240 hours ,in case you get sick they can get the hours back till the end of the following bid period be contactable at all times airport standby's and a lousy pay rate.i reckon you dont need a flat, ymca or a hostel will do on your layover in london. remember every sector is long range. i hope hugh lines up for the position , he/ she deserves it