getting into commercial aviation

[dc14uk]

I have recently completed my "Private Pilots License" course and am concidering a career as a Pilot. I am not wanting to be an airline pilot, but was looking for other aviation jobs, and was wanting find out what best way to get into it and the requirments, do you have to have an ATPL for all types commercial flying or is a CPL enough for non-airline jobs?
any info or help would be greatly welcomed
David

[flymia]

Well for even a Regional airline you dont need a ATP. But besides for Airline flying. There is Bizjet flying cargo flying are the two major ones. Also military flying which you dont need anything for that. Than there are small jobs like maybe crop dusters or surveyers. For Cargo or Biz Jet jobs the requierments are around the same as airline jobs.

[Vee One...Rotate]

In the UK you will need an ATPL (equivalent of an ATP?) to fly any type of airliner including regional ones. For instructing, I think a CPL (+ Instructor Rating of course) is required as you're flying for financial gain/reward. I understand that the difference between a CPL and fATPL ("frozen" ATPL) is simply that more exams need to be sat to get the licence...it will become a full ATPL when sufficient flying hours have been amassed.

If you go to the CAA's website and search for the LASORS document, yoiu'll get a (very thorough!) breakdown of everything to do with licences here in the UK.

Good luck,

V1R :ok:

[jau]

My understanding is this: (im sure i'll get picked up if I'm wrong)

In order to fly as PIC in a multi crew aircraft you need a full ATPL. With a frozen ATPL you may still fly multi crew, but only as co-pilot.

With just a CPL you may only fly PIC in aircraft requiring a single pilot. ie: Instructing, air taxi, etc. Though to fly a public commercial operation single pilot with passengers you will need 700 hours, I believe. You don't need 700 hours if your flying passengers who are 'private owners'.

If you want a CPL, then as well as the flight instruction you will need to complete the CPL theories. If you have already sat the 14 ATPL theoretical exams, however, then you are exempt from having to sit the CPL theories. The problem is that everyone who wants to be a pilot generally wants to fly for the airlines and so goes and sits the ATPL's. This means that few schools provide CPL theoretical training as everyone who wants to take their CPL already has ATPL theory passes.

An IR would be pretty much essential, and you will need a MECR if you want to fly multi engine aircraft.

http://www.ppjn.com/tcontactlist.html lists some of the air taxi/corporate jobs going.

I hope that helps...

[dc14uk]

thanks for the info that is helpful
david:ok:

[Send Clowns]

Not helpful at all, David, as it is all wrong so far!

There is not really such a thing as a frozen ATPL. That is shorthand for a CPL/IR with passes in the ATPL exams before the hours requirements have been met to allow the pilot a full ATPL. The priviliges are therefore identical to those of a CPL with IR.

The CPL allows you to earn money from flying, either as PIC of a single-crew aircraft or a crew member of a multi-crew aircraft.

The ATPL allows you, in addition, to act as captain of a multi-crew aircraft.

To start a CPL course you will need passes in either the ATPL or the CPL exams, 150 hours flying including 5 hours night. To be issued the licence (learn to spell it in English, rather than American if you want a good CV for the UK!) you must have 200 hours and have flown a 300-nm (straight-line distances) cross country trip, landing at 2 airfields away from your point of departure.

To start an IR you need passes in either the ATPL or the IR exams. Not sure about the hours requirements.

You will find that, with the exception of instructing at PPL level (a job that is great fun but with poor pay and few prospects for advancement within the PPL world) and perhaps para-dropping (hard to get into) you will need a CPL with IR at the very least. You may as well, therefore, start on the road to an ATPL. If you tried the CPL and IR exams separately you sit more, including one with identical syllabus, sitting alongside ATPL candidates, but you have to pass it twice. Then if you want to find a nice job on a multi-crew aircraft, even a small bizjet or most twin turbo-props, you are looking multi-crew. They will expect you to be ready to be captain after a couple of years, so will rarely take on anyone who has not already passed the ATPLs, so that's another set of 14 exams to pass. You end up taking more than twice the number.

[Captain Ratpup]

Thanks Send Clowns for posting the correct information. A frozen ATPL is a CPL and an IR.

Ratpup