Out of date NATS info booklet.....

[Little Fly Girl]

Hi all.

Recently got invite for initial NATS selection tests, and enclosed (as I guess most of you know) was a booklet about NATS & the UK ATC system, details about 24+ different a/c that are frequently found in UK airspace etc... Instructions to learn this info is given, as apparently we will be tested on it.

However, I have noticed that several parts of the booklet are out of date, ie refer to LATCC (with no mention of NERC), and states that NATS is wholey-owned by the CAA etc (excuse me if I'm wrong, but I thought this changed a while back?!) Anyhow, the booklet states that questions will be asked on info given. So, when/if I'm asked, do I give the real answers, or follow what the booklet says? I feel inclined to give the most up to date answers, but I don't want to score badly on the tests if NATS are still using the old marking system!

Sorry to babble on and on etc, but this is really bugging me, and I desperately want to do well!

So, if anyone in the know can help me, I'd be most grateful. Cheers. <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

[ 03 February 2002: Message edited by: Little Fly Girl ]</p>

[WAIF-er]

Dont worry, there arent any questions about NATS ownership etc. There arent any NERC questions either!

I did it in December and passed, thats why I know.

[Avoiding__Action]

Why would they ask you questions about NERC opening in DECEMBER!!!!

If you happen to be asked something that has recently changed , such as ownership or Nerc and you know the answer give them the uptodate info, it shows an interest in whats going on, not just that you have read the info they have sent you.

And Waif just because it wasn't asked on yours! The same questions aren't asked at every interview you know

[WX Man]

I was told by them on NATS's stand at the national graduate recruitment exhibition that it may be incorrect, but that doesn't matter. What they are assessing with this is your ability to absorb information. So learn it and expect to have to regurgitate bits of it on a test paper.

[flyingwingofjazzdestiny]

Hello Little Fly Girl,. .I did the tests back in November and got through.. .I had exactly the same worries as you because,yes, parts of the booklet are out of date. . .However apart from the stuff on ownership and the. .little bit about RVSM it`s all still relevant.. .Make sure you are certain about figures,acronyms etc contained in the document because the test is multi-choice and a shade of doubt in your mind can sway you!!. .Best of Luck.

[Little Fly Girl]

Thanks for the info and help guys! Think i will learn the booklet info but keep the up to date issues/situations in the back of my mind, just incase they want us to use it. Play it safe I think!

flyingwingofjazzdestiny, can you please e-mail me? thanks.

Thanks again! <img src="smile.gif" border="0">

[ 04 February 2002: Message edited by: Little Fly Girl ]</p>

[No I meant turn RIGHT]

LFG,

Treat it like any other real world problem.

Answers along the lines of 'The info in a booklet I was sent says X but I notice that since December Y has been the case' should win lots of Smartie points.

As has been pointed out many times on this board, there are rarely absolute right or wrong answers to selection board scenarios and questions (just like doing ATC really). What the selectors will be looking for is logical thinking, no getting flustered and being ready to reassess your answer in the light of new information. . .The last one is very important. Don't get flustered just because you think you've given an answer and one of the Board move the goalposts with something you hadn't thought of and that makes your answer not the best solution - its not that you're wrong just that they want to see if yo'll think it through, recognise that you may not be right, and be prepared to give a different answer (but do explain why you've changed your mind!).. .And Good Luck!

[Little Fly Girl]

Thanks for that sound advice, No I meant turn RIGHT! (that name is so long!) Make sure I take note! :)

[controller friendly]

Little Fly Girl

As someone who is involved in recruitment, learn the booklet and answer your questions at the testing stage from the booklet. you see the people who correct them are recruitment staff and they mark it according to set instructions not the most up to date information.. .The interview stage is different, then you can show your up to date knowledge. As was stated earlier the whole point of that particular test is to test yur commitment.. .Good Luck <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> . .CF

[WAIF-er]

avoiding action,

I dont think I will bother posting information on here any more, because I just get idiots posting ill-thought comments, when I am trying to help. Can I just point out a few things:

1. The INITIAL selection tests have been the same for at least 3 years that I know of and the information that NATS send you relates directly to those tests.

2. NERC has been in the planning for many years, it didnt just appear last week, so any questions relating to it would be in the information in DECEMBER.

3. NATS are not conducting a pub-style quiz, it is an exam that measures your ability to read the information contained in the booklet, then answer questions based on it.

4. As pointed out above, its not always about what you know, but how you can apply yourself to different scenarios, how logical your thinking and problem solving skills are, plus your motivation and reasons for why you want to become an ATCO. (You dont have to be a plane spotter.)

. .PS. anyone who sat final interviews last week, ie. 31st Jan & 1st Feb. How did you get on?

I passed! See you in October!

[Avoiding__Action]

Waifer you were specifically talking about NERC being open which is why I said why would they ask you about it in December <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

I think I might be in a position to know more about it <img src="wink.gif" border="0"> (having passed the selection tests at some point in the past!)

[WAIF-er]

Look,

if you read the thread again, Little fly girl is talking about the initial tests. let her worry about the interview and any possible questions when/if she gets to that phase. I was also referring to the question that was asked and not my interview, because I didnt have my interview till the end of jan and not december. Just read the thread again and maybe it will become clearer.

Dont assume anything. It will make an ass out of u and me.

PS. maybe as you did the tests a while ago, your memory is failing you! <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

[Erm OK probably]

Well WAIF-er I can only assume that you've got through the selection tests on the basis of your unerring confidence. I wish you well with your college training and hope that the lecturers (and any other idiots who may choose to disagree with you) value your edifying contributions.

. .I sincerely hope also that your apparent attitude is not typical of new entrants to the ATC business.

. .And a word or two of advice - if or when you get to your unit training be prepared to accept that people with many years of experience might actually be able to teach you something. If you'll listen!

And sorry to Little Fly Girl for going a bit off topic!

[Edited to apologise to LFG]

[ 08 February 2002: Message edited by: Erm OK probably ]</p>

[Little Fly Girl]

Now now, Gentlemen...

Play nicely!!! <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

[Erm OK probably]

Hey LFG, I was being polite! <img src="tongue.gif" border="0">

[WAIF-er]

Hate to be a pain, but just incase anyone reading this is confused, hope the following helps. It is taken verbatim from the letter that NATS sent me.

"The aptitude tests are followed by a multiple choice motivation and interest paper. The questions are drawn from the enclosed (out of date!) booklet please ensure that you read this booklet thoroughly as along with the aptitude tests, it is an important part of the selection. It is a timed test lasting 18 minutes."

Having read the booklet, I can say that there is no information about NATS new ownership and there is no info on NERC either. It is therefore safe to assume that the exam questions that are drawn from the booklet do not ask about NATS new ownership, nor does the exam ask about NERC. This is because it is based on the information in the booklet and there is no information in the booklet about NERC or NATS new ownership. The exam is multiple choice as stated above, therefore the answers are there to choose from. The answers are also based on the information contained in the booklet. You will not be asked any other questions on the selection day. The day consists of the exams and tests that are detailed in the letter that NATS send you. No surprises, no trick questions.

Hope this answers the original question.

[ 10 February 2002: Message edited by: WAIF-er ]</p>

[Avoiding__Action]

LOL @ Waifer may I wish you good luck in the job front hope you get in.....can't wait for the possibility of you arriving at my unit for training!!!!!!!!! <img src="tongue.gif" border="0"> <img src="tongue.gif" border="0">

As has been pointed out quite validly, you haven't even started your air traffic career yet. You have ALOT to learn, and you will learn what you need from those experienced controllers and mentors around you, at various times during your training both at the college and at the various units you may get sent too. Take this as a piece of friendly advice, don't let your overconfidence be your downfall as it has many others! This is a team game not one for over-inflated ego's.

And remember you can never go into an interview with TOO much information.

[ 11 February 2002: Message edited by: Avoiding__Action ]</p>

[WAIF-er]

Advice always welcomed.

A friend once said to me "a word of advice: never accept others advice!"

Looking forward to October. <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0"> <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

[NorthernSky]

Aaaah, all you need for an argument is a few ATCOs, a couple of wannabe ATCOs, and a bulletin board!!!

Can't help feeling that NATS would do better to publish up-to-date, accurate, 'gen', though. Still, if they did, they'd be out of step with the whole airline world :) :) :) :)

[Dog On Wheels]

[quote]Aaaah, all you need for an argument is a few ATCOs, a couple of wannabe ATCOs, and a bulletin board!!! <hr></blockquote>

Well, I'll vouch for that <img src="frown.gif" border="0">