Pay Up Front or PAYG??

[liveandletdye]

Hi all,
Newbie on the loose so bear with me:confused:

Having spent a good couple of weeks reading some of the very informative topics discussed in this forum its come to my attention that many posters are dead against paying up front for flight training. I'm currently workin my ass off saving up to do my PPL most likely with Multiflight at LBA, and their pay in advance structure for 45 hr course means a considerable saving over paying by the hour.

I'd be glad of any feedback as to reasons why the pay in advance scheme is frowned upon.
Cheers peeps.:ok:

[cumulus]

Paying up front becomes a problem if the flight school folds, as flight schools are wont to do. :( You then find yourself at the end of a rather long line of creditors, with little possibility of recouping all your money. That said, it is advice most commonly given to people who are about to embark on an integrated training course, where you would laying down up to 70 odd grand, and would be with that organisation for 12 months plus, and hence be exposed to risk for that long. If you get the Hughes Guide to becoming a pilot, it is something he seems to repeat every few pages, and in bold type!

[birdlady]

HI

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT. I was bitten on the ass very badly but not as badly as some of the other students when my flying school folded. The way to look at is why do they need the cash up front???? Could it be that they are running out of funds????

Ciao BL

[cfimei]

The two previous post are absolutely correct but I should also add that in paying as you go - the control rests in your hands, not the flight schools. So if you aren't happy and decide to fly somewhere else, a lenghty wait for a "possible" refund isn't an issue. Reputable schools won't insist on pre-pay unless you're hour building and looking for big discounts. I can't understand why people are so willing to hand over tens of thousands of pounds/dollars upfront but I guess it's the lure of airline 'connections'. No play on the latter word I might add.

[Mosspigs]

One thing to remember when paying up front is that you may decide this flying lark isn't for you.

I would doubt very much that the flight school would refund your hard earned wedge because you've changed your mind.

Shop around, it may be that by travelling a few miles, you'll find a significantly cheaper and equally capable school.

[Number Cruncher]

I did a PPL and paid up front. It saved me about 500 quid so was worthwhile.

I presume you DO like flying as what sort of Plonker would throw away £5k on something they have never tried, bit like buying a car without having test driven it....?!

Go on to the Companies House website. Order the last set of company accounts (costs about £5-£15??). Even if they're abbreviated, better than nothing. Do a few liquidity ratios and come to your own conclusion. Other than that, other indicators of its ability to continue as a going concern would be how long it’s been around and the amount of aircraft it operates.

Good luck

[Sensible]

Pay up front:

For; you get a discount probably. Great!

Against;

If you find flying isn't for you. Tough!
If you want to change flight school. Tough!
You are unable to continue through a change in your own circumstances. Tough!
If the school goes bust -loads do. Tough!
You have a complaint that "trial flighters" take precedence over you because your money is in the bank and the trial flighter's isn't. Tough!

One of life's rules is don't lend money to anybody or pay up front any sum of money which would be painful for you if you didn't get it back. But human quest for a "bargain" dictates that some do and will continue to pay up front.

Number Cruncher, Other than that, other indicators of its ability to continue as a going concern would be how long it’s been around and the amount of aircraft it operates. Remember SFT at Bournemouth? The problem is that schools usually don't actually own the aircraft, they are owned by a holding company, a separate company or the bank even.

[Send Clowns]

Reputable schools won't insist on pre-pay unless you're hour building and looking for big discountsEven then it is possible to pay as you fly, and then pick up the discount as a nice, fat reduction off your CPL and IR. Truly reputable schools give you a discount for booking in advance and flying a large amount of the training with them (because aircraft that are flown a lot are genuinely cheaper to run, and that is only possible with a lot of pre-booked flying), not to keep their cash flow and impress the banks.

I put my hands up: I made the error once, and recently had to pay well over £2000 to do the training I had paid a certain company for, before they stopped trading. Fortunately, although I also lost a job with that same company, I could afford the loss and my current employer helped me to do so by their easy terms and staff discount. I have friends who could not afford what they lost.

[liveandletdye]

Thanks to everyone who took time out to reply, much appreciated.:D

I've since purchased the Clive Hughes manual and its answered quite a few uncertainties. Cheers, you've all been a big help.

[sheii]

liveand letdye...

how about putting your payment with your credit card thus if they fold you can get the money paid back under one of those insurance covers that the cc comes with on purchases...thus you will in a way be covered if they fold.....but check first that you are covered for compesation with your card provider ....i know of some pple who got there money back when a school folded and its cos they hard paid with there cc and all the rest who had paid by other means were left high and dry:{

[arfur-sixpence]

The FTO that I work for only ask that you pay the bill as you go along - basically settle you account on a weekly basis.

Any reputable school would refund any unused balance should you pay up front and them change your mind - and should be willing to provide a written staement to that effect. If they won't - then go somewhere else.

If you do pay up front - do it on a credit card. However, then bank charges us 2.5% for the privilege and so we have to pass that on.

[almighty bruce]

? how do you know the training school is actually solvent?

I was thinking of starting my training CPL locally due costs of staying away and the school I was looking at has asked for money up front . Although seeming reputable but small I have heard rumours now that they may owe money about the place.
Is there any way you can do a company check find out for sure.
They are offering a discount if you pay up front. I notice they do this also for PPL. How could you check that they would be able to pay you back if you decided not to continue. It would take a long time to go through courts etc. and delay getting your cash or loosing it.

[Send Clowns]

One of the problems of paying up front is that you may not be legally entitled to all your money back. Certainly the contract I signed said I had to cover 25% of the cost of training agreed to but not taken up. One of the reasons for my admission above that it had been an error to pay this way.