Is it worth it to self fund?

[redmania]

I am thinking about self funding my way through a JAA ab initio course in the USA. Is it worth it? What will job prospects be like in 2 years and is the sponsorship route the only way? I really would not want to come back to blighty and be skint with 1000hrs and 0 job prospects.

I'd really appreciate some advice please.

[IRRenewal]

What will job prospects be like in 2 years

I don't think anybody knows what it will be like in two months, let alone two years.

[K2SkyRider]

redmania,

The question you need to ask yourself is in ten years time will you look back and think 'I wish I had become a pilot' or will you think 'I wish I hadn't wasted that money, this isn't the career for me'.

Cheers,

K2 :ok:

[redmania]

Any self funders care to give any advice?

Cheers

[peterfoele]

Hi redmania,

I have been a self funder all the way. Have seen all colours of snow (mostly black;) ) but when I look back (still have no job as a pilot BTW) I do not regret my choise. Had some valuable lessons, and not only regarding flying, I learned a lot of my personality as well.

As K2Skyrider says : think about ten years from know, ask the relevant question, and work from there.

Good luck if/when you start your training

Peter

[Penworth]

Obviously its hard to know how you're going to feel in 10 years time about the decisions you made back in 2004, but if you're swithering about whether it would be a good idea, then I'd suggest you perhaps don't want it enough to take all the grief and hassles that you'll no doubt encounter throughout your training and job hunting. There are enough people out there who, fully aware of the risks of spending all that money and time and coming out with nothing, are still prepared to take that risk to pursue their goal. I'm self funding, and know that there is a possibility I will never fly commercially, but am still prepared to give it a go. At least if I fail, I know I will have tried, and the way I'm doing it (modular, in stages while working simultaneously) means that I wont have a mountain of debt to pay off on completion of training.

Good luck with your decision.

PW

[Virtual Reality]

Hi Redmania,

Getting a pilot licence is just like getting your first degree, it does not guarantee you a job but certainly will make you a better person, my advice is, go for it and subsequently, hunt for any flying job to build up your hours and experience, with positive attitude towards flying, staying away from 'politics' and bit of luck, you should be getting your 4 bars oneday, just like others. Don't talk about future because no one knows what the future holds.

Good luck ........:cool:

[habcer]

Hi,

I am in a similar position. I am about to start an integrated course having just taken a loan for £63,000. My loan repayments will be £870 per month for 8 years.

I have no money, my parents have no money but it is a risk I have to take. The airline industry is looking much better and I believe now is the time.

I am one of the people who might look back in a few years and say 'I wish I had done that then'. Chances are, I'll get no job, and with no degree I'll be working for John Smiths burger bar living with my parents, trying to meet the repayments for 8 years!

But there is no other way than forking out the cash and paying for it. If you think you will get a sponsorship, then you may as well give up on your career choice now, it almost certainly wont happen.

So if you think you can deal with years of misery in having no money, but you knew it was for very good reason, then do it.

[flystudent]

The unfortunate thing is now that more and more airlines are taking the, "well if you can pay for your own ATPL, why not make them pay for their own type rating too" stance, another chunk of money there after.

So perhaps for example a recent one is you have to fork £20K just for the rating to jet a job that pays perhaps £25K first year and you have £83K worth of debt.

I imagine the total repayments would be £1160 a month !!(based on your £870 recalc figure of £63K) That means that you would have to earn approx £1500 (assuming 30% tax & NI) just to pay that bit back a month totalling circa £18,100 a year in debt repayment.

leaving you £7k to house yourself and live (£575 before tax a month left, that's £383 in your hand a month after tax & NI !!) all that assuming interest/borrowing rates at todays level, which they wont be !!

Sounds terrible, Imho it strengthens the case for modular over integrated as the £20K difference could be spent on the type rating !!

I am an integrated student due to finish training in a couple of months. Some people on my course love it , others wish they had never started and done something else with the money especially now that odds are high of having to fork out more for type ratings. (some simply wont be able to secure funds to do this with £60K already on their shoulders)

Regards & no offence intended.

[K2SkyRider]

habcer,

If you think you will get a sponsorship, then you may as well give up on your career choice now, it almost certainly wont happen.

I'm afraid I strongly disagree with this attitude. Although the competition is fierce for sponsorships, they are available and offer an excellent opportunity to wannabes. Anyone who meets the minimum criteria to apply for sponsorships (e.g. CTC-McAlpine, Britannia) should apply and try their luck. Yes, the odds are agaist you, but never worry about the odds - if you are what they are looking for, you will get in.

Cheers,

K2 :ok:

[wheelbarrow]

redmania

I self funded in 1999. I had the majority of money to go to Oxford from my career on the Stock Exchange. Only borrowed enough to live on for the 14 month course.

I got lucky afterwards. I joined jmc straight on a 757.

5 years exactly from starting my course, I paid off my borrowings, and am now relatively well off.

My point is: it takes a lot of luck ,and a lot of sacrifice and debt to get there.

If you really want to be a pilot, then go for it. If it is a pipedream... don't bother.

Hopefully, the trend of jobs becoming available today will continue. That way perhaps a few more of your wannabee brethren will not be blocking your path to employment when you graduate.

[flystudent]

K2skyrider & Habcer

Agree with both of your posts. Habcer's glass is half empty and is planning on the likely route one would have to take if sponsorship is a no go.

K2skyrider's glass is half full :O

I would say try for the sponsorships whole heartedly, but plan for what happens if they are unsuccessful, i.e. cover all bases I know that sounds so simple but you would be amazed how many people don't think "what if" ( I used to be guilty of that :{:)

Also remember that even some of the sponsorships don't guarantee a job at the end.

regards & no offence.

Flystudent :ok:

[redmania]

Cheers for the info guys.

I am looking to go to Comair aviation academy as they do a JAA ab-initio 0hrs to 1500hrs scheme for around £35K. And they use Sanford airport which is fairly busy. I am in the early stages at the moment and I am hoping to start early 2005 after I have secured the funds. Does anyone have any recomendations for JAA courses in the US? And any information as to how one might secure the funds with a bank?

[redmania]

any self funders care to give advice?

[CB1]

I've been looking into self funding in the US. The thing i'd say about com air is that it isn't an integrated course. From what i've heard several airlines have said they will only take integrated low hours pilots.

Have a look at http://www.wmich.edu/aviation/index.htm it's pretty interesting and from what the CAA say its the only US located JAA approved institute on the integrated route.

I think i'm pretty much in the same boat as you, and hundreds of others with a pretty big gamble to take if we want to fufil our dreams! I've passed the oxford selection tests but just not sure if i can afford to take out a loan to cover my training. The US training works out about £10 000 cheaper overall so its got the advantage!!

Cheers & good luck!!

Chris