Could a new aircraft be built in Belfast?

[NWSRG]

Reports from Bombardier suggest that they are open to the idea of the Belfast plant being the final assembly point for the new regional jet they are looking at.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/3498491.stm

Hopefully government will provide the right package to make this happen. And hopefully Bombardier are not using this just to pressurise Canadian authorities into providing better support packages. Airliner production back in the UK...would be nice to see.

[mr Q]

Just as the government provided the right package for John Z
De Lorean.......and Courtaulds......:rolleyes:

[BoeingMEL]

Well...if it happens let's hope they're in no way related to the old sheds... dear Lord what a load of sileage! bm

[Tower Ranger]

I think it`s extremely unlikely and would agree that it is designed not only to put pressure on the Canadian Govt but also to have an effect on the present labour relation problems at the site.
Obviously if it comes to pass it will be fantastic news for Belfast (if not the tax payer) .

BM Can`t agree with your comment on the shed , it did exactly what it said on the tin !!!

[GlueBall]

Wasn't the Titanic built there?

[Rosbif]

Sure was. I'm sure everyone has heard about the Shorts being a great air(o)plane if you take it out of the packing crate before you try to use it. Haven't posted today. Thought I might !

[jetfour]

No, not while the workforce is hell-bent on self-destruction.

p.s The Titanic was built in a shipyard - not an aircraft factory!

[411A]

The question is....just why would anyone want to build an aircraft in Belfast?

Good grief, many more places where it would make more sense.:uhoh:

[Evening Star]

The question is....just why would anyone want to build an aircraft in Belfast?

Good grief, many more places where it would make more sense.

And what precisely is the problem with Belfast?

If you are worried about far flung places to build aircraft, I gather Seattle is considered pretty remote from the 'market'.

[hushkit77]

You yankee doodle dandys really don't have a clue do you!!

411A... what the hell is wrong with Belfast...... they make plenty of parts for your precious Boeings over there.
Where exactly would make 'sense' to make aircraft. Have you looked at any current assembly locations that are so much more 'sensible'?

BMEL... have you flown a shed??

Jetfour... quality comment re. the Titanic. GB most likely doesn't know it was a ship!!

[IFTB]

The mere fact that Belfast has a harbour makes it ideal for manufacturing.
No roadtransport of large items required.
Originally ofcouirse the presence of (shipyard) welders/riveters was a good thing.
"The shed" was a magic beast. The Sherpa a bit touchy but equally good. What you call value for money.
Good on you Belfast, hope you get the work and that it's not a Bombardier stunt.

[maninblack]

Shorts/Bombardier made many mistakes with the Tucano, the most obvious one was getting rid of everyone who had completed puberty and letting all the local graduates design it unsupervised. I was 24 when I was on that project and I was the oldest guy in many of the meetings.

With Lear 45 they hired a lot of old boys to act as engineering "Dad", each team had a "Dad" whose job was to ask difficult and sometimes misleading questions in order to make sure they had considered all angles of a problem.

It worked.

I haven't been to Shorts for a few years now but if this kind of ethos remains in any way then they deserve to build an aircraft and I wish them luck.

[IFTB]

MIB,

The TUCANO?
Shorts never "designed" anything on it but the engine installation (Garett TPE331 if I remember well) and required system adaptions.
First flight ended up in a "precautionary engine shutdown", on a single engined machine this a little dangerous but as oil does not travel uphill very well it had to be so.

Excuse my sarcasm, but Shorts was capable of a lot more than the Tucano "handout "they got landed with, which they had little or no control over and which helped to pull the plug, as you also mention.

Wasted a lot of experienced and enthousiastic aircraft people.

Unfortunately the UK has a habit of doing that.

[rotornut]

The question is....just why would anyone want to build an aircraft in Belfast?

Ever heard of a Sunderland?

[maninblack]

IFTB,

Tucano started out as a simple re-engined concept of the Brazilian aircraft, however, the cockpit was redesigned, the electrical system was redesigned and during the development and build a vast amount of the airframe and systems were rejigged.

This came about because a surprising amount of the original spec aircraft was based upon commercial & non-aerospace specification materials that were not acceptable to Shorts or the RAF.

I worked on many major systems on the aircraft over several years and would put my hand on my heart and say honestly that the aircraft in service has little in common with the Brazilian aircraft in detailed design, build or specification.

That aside, I agree that the wrong aircraft was built, it was a political hadout and allowed the loss of much talent and skill from UK PLC engineering.

[IFTB]

Sorry MIB, I did not intend to insult your skills. It was more the principle of Shorts having been forced to go after the trainer contract , which in my mind was a dead duck to start with and waisted a lot of good designers skills and eventually killing Shorts in house design capacity.

I had a lot of time and respect for them. Skateboard Jimmy & Co were pretty good at their jobs.

IFTB

[maninblack]

IFTB,

It is very easy to be misunderstood on a forum so I will sya it clearly, I didn't take offense, I was merely trying to point out that the Shorts Tucano, in spite of what the world thought, was a very different beast from its more exotic parent.

Re reading my post I can see how it could be seen as a snotty self defensive posting, again this was not the intended spirit of the posting.

As for Shorts, it is a very sad state of affairs as the skills base and work ethic amongst the staff used to be superb.

:ok:

[411A]

Unless and until the political problems are settled permanently (don't hold your breath)in Northern Ireland, 'tis not likely anything new will be built there.

[IFTB]

Since when have the "political problems" had an influence on the products built in Belfast?

[jetfour]

At least, with all our troubles, the democratic leader actually got the most votes!

[BoeingMEL]

hushkit77.... yes I have flown sheds 360-300 with Micky Mouse half-EFIS...almost 900 hours P1. (I actually designed the 1P panel placard which read "WARNING...THIS AIRCRAFT IS NOT HEADWIND COMPATIBLE!") BTW... if they do ever produce more aircraft there, will the balaclava boys come back for their weekly "sweeteners?" bm

[IFTB]

What are some folk trying to prove here?
Yes, there are problems in Belfast, those who live there are no doubt very much aware of it and do not need anyone to remind them.
And yes they are very capable of building sophisticated machinery, including aircraft. ANd hopefully they will get another chance to prove it. And that was the subject right?

Why bang on about "...if they produce more aircraft there, will the balaclava boys......etc.etc.

Utter ****e!
Excuse the drop in tolerance level but continuously linking the two is a little....shortsighted.

I'll give it a rest now.

[maninblack]

I never came across "The Boys" taking backhanders from Shorts, quite the opposite, but I did witness them firsthand phoning up chief engineers to remind them that they should maintain a non-sectarian recruitment policy.

[eastern wiseguy]

remind them that they should maintain a non-sectarian recruitment policy.



Quite right....now lets get on and build something!!!:ok: :ok:

[Kestrel_909]

You mean the Titanic was a ship? By gawh, that explains how it hit an iceberg, I can sleep soundly tonight:eek:



411A, excuse us but many fine products have come out of Belfast and still do! One thing that springs to mind is the undercarriage doors for the 747!

Should the news be true, it's good news :)