BY Accident at Gerona 1999

[fireflybob]

Anyone tell me if the official accident report to the Britannia 757 at Gerona in 1999 (I think) has been published yet - if so is there a link to the report on the www

Thanks for any help

[df1]

I too was looking for that recently!

It looks as though there is still only the special bulletin On the AAIB website: http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_avsafety/documents/page/dft_avsafety_503168.hcsp

[Daysleeper]

I belive BALPA are still campaigning the Spanish to publish the report. Funny they seem reticent to do so. Nothing like an open and honest reporting/investigating system. Thank goodness for the way we do things in the UK.

[EightsOnPylons]

Some other links/photos:

http://aviation-safety.net/database/1999/990914-0.htm

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?regsearch=G-BYAG

[Man Flex]

Just out of interest, I was in Menorca that night and the lightning show was quite spectacular. Eerie too as I never heard any thunder associated with it.

There is strong speculation that there was a power cut at the airfield just as the aircraft was making its second approach and literally seconds from touchdown.

[A330ETOPS]

it was Alpha Golf (G-BYAG). It was on approach in severe weather conditions. all other airports in the area were forced to close, and the a/c had attempted to land several times before at gerona. It skidded off the runway onto a nearby field, and split into 3 parts. Luckily nobody was hurt, but apparantly, one bloke died in hospital of a heart attack a few days later! hope that helps

[Human Factor]

There is strong speculation that there was a power cut at the airfield just as the aircraft was making its second approach and literally seconds from touchdown.

If so, it may explain the Spanish reticence to release the report.

[A330ETOPS]

i wouldn't have thought that would have had an effect, due to the fact that all major airports have an emergency power supply. not too sure tho. i'll see what i can find out

[willoman]

The 757 did only one other approach and that was a VOR to RW 02. Because of an excessive tailwind, it did a go-around and went directly into an ILS on RW20 ( all IMC in heavy rain )
On becoming contact after the ILS it is suggested that the R/W lights may NOT have been switched and a subsequent lightning strike may have eradicated any remaining side lights.
All conjecture of course but the the reporting delay seems as though there could be something in the ATC contribution to the accident.

[snooky]

It does seem strange to me that even after something like this has happened, some large operators still advocate less and less fuel.

Whatever the cause is eventually attributed to, undoubtedly more fuel would have resulted in less pressure and risk.

I wonder how many tons extra could be carried before the cost of a 757 is reached.

[chipmunkj]

fireflybob

Accident report is due in 2004 - hopefully!

[Right Way Up]

Snooky,
Can you back your statements up with hard facts or are you just surmising the amount of fuel that the Captain had loaded? Would have thought with the price of fuel in GRO and it being a 757 that round trip fuel would have been on board.

[snooky]

You're right, just surmising and maybe wrong, though given a choice most pilots would choose to avoid landing in a thunderstorm.
If this sort of surmising is wrong, then apologies, I'm guilty.

What worries me though is that I do know of a 757 which did have to land in a thunderstorm recently (successfully this time) so if my surmising is correct surely lessons are there to be learned, and the sooner the better.

[Stan Woolley]

Right Way Up

Normally you'd be right but I don't think this flight was tanking fuel because it originated in Cardiff.

In either event I heard it had around three tons remaining, which is plenty if you're turning off the runway, but not a lot if you're going around (again)on a night like the one in question.

[fireflybob]

No doubt many of these factors under discussion will be in the official report when it is published.

It may be that the report has been finalised but "interested parties" have been given a chance to read same and comment on any conclusions. I believe there is some kind of statutory requirement to do so under the UK accident investigation regs so perhaps there are some points of issue which are still being thrashed out.

Like many I am interested in seeing the full report to see what we can learn from this accident.

[Daysleeper]

report finally published on AAIB reports site.

http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_avsafety/documents/page/dft_avsafety_502518.hcsp

Bit of a swiss cheese accident really.

[sky9]

The recommendation that stands out us as pilots is REC 31/04. I have always been of the view that you either take sector fuel because there is no reason to take any more, or you take (in the case of the 757) at least a couple of tonnes because the situation warrants it. In a situation where thunderstorms are forecast over a wide area including alternates 3 tonnes should be the minimum extra. I followed this policy in Britannia and was never questioned by management pilots about my fuel calculations. The extra 15 minutes holding on this flight was of no use at all.

As far as the actual accident is concerned "there by the grace of god go I" A very nasty position to find oneself in and I question whether anyone could honestly say that they would have acted differently. The only point is would the crew have started an appoach if they had another 3 tonnes in the tanks.

[Tommyinyork]

What happened to the remains of G-BYAG, and what aircraft replaced her, was it a Swedish BY 757.

[willoman]

Remains sold to a Spanish scrap dealer by the insurance company.
The aircraft was never replaced - insurance money accepted.

[fireflybob]

sky9, I must confess I have not yet read the entire report but isn't your suggestion of an extra 2 or three tons a bit arbitrary?

If the destination is tempoing (= change of up to one hour) thunderstorms then perhaps carry an extra one hours holding. If, in addition, the alternate is also tempoing the same then best find another alternate with better weather.

Flying around in such weather without a lot of extra fuel puts crews under enormous pressure and, I believe, this accident is an example of what can happen. The crew and, in particular, the captain have all my sympathies and it was fortuitous that all came away unscathed.

[Daysleeper]

All came away unscathed

Except the one fatality 2 seriously injured and 41 minor.

Still amazing there were not more fatalities.
Its a bit disgusting that the electricity company responsible for the runway lighting and the hospital both refused to assist in the investigation.

Also makes you wonder why the report took 5 years to come out. Was a lot less contentious and more balanced than I was expecting.