need some advice please

[lfc]

hi everyone,

Im currently 17 (18 in march) and in my final year of a-levels at college. Becoming a commercial pilot has always been my dream. I am thinking of going to South Africa at the end of this year to start my training. Its in Port Elizabeth: 'Aptrac' its called. I just wanted some advice on this really, as i dont want to make any mistakes along the way. Im doing English Language, Media Studies and Communication Studies at A-Level, because i wanted a back-up plan of the media industry, incase the pilot ambition failed for some reason. I contacted 'aptrac', and they said that maths and physics a-level isnt a must. Also, is getting a proffessional studies loan a good idea? I Would be very grateful if you could give me some advice on what i should do. Many Thanks.

[FlyingForFun]

Hmm - lots of bits of information, but no detail, so it's hard to answer your questions.I am thinking of going to South AfricaWhy?Its in Port Elizabeth: 'Aptrac' its calledI've never heard of that school. Do they do JAR licenses there? Or were you planning on getting a South African license? If you were planning on getting a South African license, were you planning on converting it to JAR later?I wanted a back-up plan of the media industry, incase the pilot ambition failed for some reasonThat's extremely sensible.I contacted 'aptrac', and they said that maths and physics a-level isnt a mustYou can certainly manage without A-levels in these subjects. Some understanding of them will help, although any course you do for the written exams should include all the knowledge you really need. Do you have good GCSEs in maths/physics?Also, is getting a proffessional studies loan a good idea?If you don't need one, it's a very bad idea. If you can't afford your training without one, then you don't have much choice, but you must be aware that you will have to repay the loan, and you must have a plan for how you intend to do that.

FFF
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[lfc]

Thank you for replying. sorry about the lack of detail. Im choosing south africa because i wanted to do it abroad as its much cheaper than doing it here in the UK. The US was another option, but after 9/11 i didnt want to do it there. 'Aptrac' stands for 'Airline Pilot Training Centre'; its in Port Elizabeth. You said you had never heard of it. Do you know of any other well known schools in South Africa with good reputations? I passed my Maths GCSE, but didnt take Physics. Another thing, i heard that the training you get is equivalent to a degree? Is this true?

[Andy_R]

Whatever FTO you decide on, make sure (absolutely so) that you are going to finish up with JAR qualifications, as also referred to by FFF. There are many flight schools in South Africa that are NOT authorised to issue you with a JAR licence, despite their advertising.

Check it out with the CAA - maybe someone will have the relevant link for you

[Backontrack]

lfc

I have flown out of Port Elizabeth and my experience was poor, it wasn't with the school you mention, I was purely hour building at the time, however the school I rented from did offer a JAR PPL and the English guys I met their were not that impressed with the level of tuition they were receiving, so think twice on your choice of schools. You also have to really watch the weather in Port Elizabeth, it was only when I arrived that I discovered that the locals also call it the windy city! This killed of the chances of getting of the ground for most of the month I was there.

I eventually had to dirve to Cape Town, I had intended to fly but poor weather put an end to that; There were some better schools I saw whilst out there though, take a look at 43rd AirSchool in Port Alfred, it has a good reputation and the facilities I saw were very good and the students I met were much more complimentary, I think they offer an integrated JAR course.

Good luck, if you have any other questions drop me a private message.

[lfc]

thnx for the advice. I am still undecided on what to do though. I want to do the training, but dont know when i should do it. People say its good to have some sort of back up plan. In my case it would be a degree in media, which i would do start next year at university. Spending three/four years for a degree is a long time, so i was thinking not to do the degree and go straight into the training. If i were to start the training after my degree i would be about 22, so i feel its better to start it early when im 18. Also i heard that the training is equivalent to a degree, is this true?

[FlyingForFun]

Lfc,

Unfortunately, the only school I've spent any time researching in S.A doesn't have a good reputation, so I can't recommend anywhere. For any UK-approved JAR training beyond PPL level, the school must have approval from the CAA. There is a complete list of schools with such approval here (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/175/srg_fcl_ApprovedFTOs.pdf), and I don't see your school anywhere on the list. It's possible that they operate under an agreement with another school which does have approval, but it's also possible that the training they are offering is for a South African license, which wouldn't be much use if you're planning on working in Europe. Check this out before you go any further with that school!

My advice to you would be as follows: Do your degree. As you say, it's vital to have a backup. It will also give you some good life experiences which will not only help your career, but which you'll also enjoy. However, there's nothing to stop you starting your flying while you're studying. It's very common to do a PPL part time, flying each weekend. It normally takes around a year to get a PPL like this, but if you're a poor student with very few beer tokens you can fly less often, and spread the course out over a couple of years (you should budget for more than minimum hours if you do this, of course, because you'll be flying less often). Once you get your PPL, you can continue to fly at weekends and build hours slowly until you finish your degree - and that's when you start the hard work of studying full-time for the ATPL exams and then on to the rest of the fATPL.

If you follow my advice, you won't be looking to go abroad for 4 years or so - until after you've passed the ATPL exams. But don't rule out America because of 9/11 - the rules about Visas and licenses are stricter, but once you sort out the paperwork it's a fantastic place to fly, and there are some very good schools there.

FFF
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[pa28biggles]

Also i heard that the training is equivalent to a degree, is this true?
This question, and whether to get a degree or not has been debated much here before, a search will prove this.
I'm at uni and I use my student loan and my part time job to pay for my hour building, I got my PPL whilst I did my A Levels. I live at home, so my living expenses are reduced over living in my own accomodation. You could do your PPL whilst at uni, but it depends on your circumstances, i.e how much money will you have left after you have paid all of your out-goings. Do some calculations and find out.:ok:

[lfc]

i wanted to know if the pilot training is equivalent to a degree. If i start the training next year without doing the degree would my training count as a degree?

[pa28biggles]

Lfc,
In short, no it wouldn't.
If you went for a job, say in management for a retail company, and you said you had an frozen ATPL, it would make no difference. Infact, if they asked/knew what an frozen ATPL is, it may make you less employable since they may think that you have interests elsewhere.
I'm currently on a 1 year work placement through university (I'm doing a sandwich degree), if they knew that I was studying my ATPL theory to become a commercial pilot, they wouldn't have taken me on.
Hope I've answered your question.

[lfc]

thnx 'pa28biggles' for that advice. Its good that you done your PPL whilst doing you A-Level's. Hope you are doing well with your ATPL. What are you studying at Uni? How much money does one need to do the PPL?

[Langeveldt]

Hey all

Good to see some people in the same boat.. Im 16 and I'm thinking about going to South Africa after college... Obviously getting my PPL would come first, ive heard of some schools along the Natal Coast (Port Alfred and Virginia)...
However my research at the moment seems to be sifting through hundreds of different abbreviations, hundreds of variations of training and FTO's all with their pros and cons... Eventually I want to do my CPL, either in SA or at home in the UK...

Im doing 4 A levels in college at the moment, inlcuding maths and physics, and am hoping for straight A's :eek:

Im already working to put some money back for all of this.. Is it possible to work while doing parts of a CPL? That would be a great help, although that would mean me doing it in the UK.... I would like to do my training without a degree, although i am fully aware of the arguments for and against..

A PM from someone in the same boat, or who has been there and done it would be nice... Order of the day will be gathering more info and opinion i guess!

Many thanks
Rich

[Amabokoboko]

Damn, Damn Damn. Just wrote a whole long missive and then got bounced when I tried to post. Hey, webmaster! Why do I have to log on an average of five times per visit to PPRUNE???

Anyway, fundamentally, heard only good things about 43 in George, check with your CAA re JAR accreditation, flying in SA by far the best value for money you're likely to get privately.

Regarding degrees, definitely get one but I would fly first, then go back to varsity. If you do 4 years at varsity, the chance of you being willing to live with your folks for another couple of years while you do your licence is slim. Also, people tend to find jobs and partners at Varsity which makes it very difficult to then abandon everything for the great blue yonder,

Good luck.

PS, lfc, I too work in media and absolutely love it. and the hours allow plenty of time for flying training.

[FlyingForFun]

Langeveldt,

Yes, it is certainly possible to work, either full or part time, whilst training for a CPL. I've done it - I had a job in IT when I started flying, I still have a job in IT now I have a CPL, and I plan on starting a Flying Instructor course without quitting my job just yet. Not quite the same as you, since I had my job well before I got into this whole flying thing, but proof that it can be done, and there are hundreds of others out there who have done the same.

FFF
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