Air Canada YYZ-DEL non-stop

[Rockhound]

Air Canada is about to launch non-stop service to Delhi from Toronto. Will this be a great circle route, ie. via Greenland, Barents Sea, Urals...?
Thanks in advance for info.
Rockhound

[Latte tester]

...let's just hope they have enough cash in hand to pay for the fuel...maybe the stock might climb...

Actually this is the first I heard about this, what equip are they planning on using?

...from the same area on the planet...;)

[Rockhound]

A340-300. The service began Oct 18.
Rockhound

[PT6A-34]

When they previously went to Delhi from YYZ using the A340 they used the "new" polar routes which shaved about 3 hours of flight time. I think that is the only way possible to go direct Delhi from Pearson unless the new A340-500 can do it otherwise. Apparently they are deffered and no time line as to when they are getting them.

Cheers

[cossack]

Planned 14 hours 15 minutes in the air according to the crew. That's a long time in coach!!!

[Rynopilot]

Gentlemen,

Russia has been denying AC permission to overfly their airspace, thus they have been forced to fly well south of the great circle route.

Read the following article.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2003/10/21/044.html

Best Regards,

Ryan O'Malley

[Rockhound]

Thanks for that, Ryan - that's very interesting.

PT6,
I was not aware that AC ever flew between Toronto and Delhi via a "polar" route. Plans were afoot a year (or two?) ago for Canada 3000 to fly to India from Canada via the pole and AC was to follow suit but those plans never materialized (and Canada 3000 went under, anyway).

Cossack,
What crew gave you a time of 14h15m? For YYZ-DEL? According to AC's schedule, by my reckoning, gate-to-gate for YYZ-DEL is 13 hrs even; DEL-YYZ is close to 15.5 hrs. Quite a difference.

Any comments?

Rockhound

[cossack]

It was the crew on the 18th I think. They said gate to gate was 14.50 and air time was planned at 14.15.
The air time can change by quite a margin with differences in wind speed and direction. Oh, and it takes a while to taxy around YYZ you know!!! ;)

[Rockhound]

Cossack,
Actually, I was referring to the difference in flight times between the eastward and westward legs, 2.5 hrs, which seems unusually high to me.
In view of all these times, the scheduled 13 hrs for YYZ-DEL seems optimistic to me, but I think my calculations are correct. Dp YYZ 1715 (local) Ar DEL 1645 (local) and 10.5 hrs time difference between the two cities. Airlines, like Air Canada, that don't show flight duration prominently in their timetables I find irritating.
Rockhound

[Phil Lister]

I hope they look out for other things... Like Refugees...

I heard that C3's first return flight Delhi to Toronto had 32 refugee applicants... At $5000 each to the airline.. That gets expensive...

[Jerricho]

Rock.....the time difference is easy!

YYZ - DEL - it's downhill!

[rotornut]

Well, it will certainly be better than Air India which used to run a
"direct" flight from Pearson to Sahar (Bombay) via LHR. It was always late and the equipment was terrible - the lavs were always breaking down, among other things.

[cossack]

Rockound
I can't account for the time differences in the scheds, typo maybe? When are they ever accurate anyway??? They're always "padded" allowing time late off the gate to be miraculously made up enroute!
As to the routing: today's was north out of YYZ then north east over Greenland and no further north than 67N, so definately not a polar route.
Jerricho
How's it goin'? Still looking forward to the move?

[Jerricho]

Hey Cossak,

Really looking forward to the move!
How life at the centre of the universe? ;) Hope they're looking after you.

[cossack]

Life is good. At the centre of the universe has got to be better than in the middle of nowhere!!! ;)

[Rockhound]

Cossack,
Thanks for that latest info. I see that AC now shows an arrival time in DEL of 1745 local (one hour later than before - maybe there was a typo?), which means a more realistic time of 14 hrs for the eastbound leg. Time for the westbound remains at 15.5 hrs.
Rockhound

[Rockhound]

The Globe and Mail of Nov 4 reports that, in retaliation for Russia's refusal to allow Air Canada to overfly Russia on its new non-stops between YYZ and DEL, Ottawa has forced Aeroflot to reduce its Moscow-Toronto service from four to two flights per week. (Aeroflot says it will switch from the 767 to the 777 to help make up the loss of capacity). The report also mentions that YYZ-DEL takes one hour longer than originally planned - this explains the discrepancy between the original schedule and the actual flight time. On Oct 31, Ottawa banned Aeroflot from Canadian airspace on its service to the US. Russia immediately responded by banning Canadian flights from Russian airspace. AC said the ban will only affect its westbound flights to Beijing. On Nov 2, Ottawa upped the ante by forcing the halving of Aeroflot's Toronto service.
Just like a bunch of schoolchildren...
Rockhound

[MarkD]

why did Ottawa ban Aeroflot from Canadian airspace en route US in the first place?

[Rockhound]

Mark,
Because Russia refused Air Canada overfly rights on its YYZ-DEL service. The tit-for-tat retaliation then carried on from there.
Rockhound

[idleopdes]

Just read that all restrictions have been cancelled while negotiations between the 2 countries continue.... this effective Nov. 27. Good news..