lo-cost carriers and coventry

[the third man]

Rumour control

Let me just say three things-

1) Coventry Airport

2) Lo-cost Airline

3) Britannia/TUI

my sources are good!

[Hwel]

Here are three more

1) no terminal

2) no terminal

3) no terminal

[the third man]

You maybe right, but my sources are extremely reliable

so:p

[luoto]

I think a new terminal building is planned, or the plans have been approved at CVT. Some of the locals where whinging about the disruption... Due to the proximity of the airport to some less desirable locations in Coventry and the mindless few ****bags who inhabit there, I am surprised the high value cargo flights really go on.

[G fiend]

If that is true what type?

Isn't a 757 too big for a lo cost start-up? I would have thought a 737-300 or similar?

[BoeingMEL]

Nice thought but......CVT is presently an airfield with rural security, one runway, no hard taxyways, no terminal (as previously stated), minimum car-parking, and lacking numerous other facilities essential to support airline ops. Just a minute! Isn't there a place called BHX just 18 miles away with all of the above? Anyway just how many folks want to fly from CVT to Bergamo or some Scandanavian destination 80 miles from the nearest log-cabin settlement? Nevertheless, good luck to them.... Cov needs more than ChanEx, Rangemile and Air Atlantic if it is to survive/prosper. bm

[the third man]

Ahh there you have it!...but connect these things!

I am given to understand that during the summer there was a BAL light a/c doing tours of the smaller airports with people from purchasing.

easyjet will be getting rid of their early 737-300s

I am given to understand that their has been a lot of work at BAL involving various 737 models.

and finally, TUI already has a lo- cost carrier- Hapag Express.

I'm gonna get some flak for this but I think that charter carriers as we know them have little future, so maybe we're seeing the big charter boys start to re-invent themselves, as they've done in the past.

just another thought...CVT will be cheap compared to BHX, EMA et al.

Ryanair have made a good business out of using smaller airfields

[LTNman]

Hamrah. I think you will find that Coventry is in the Midlands and not 25 miles from Stansted.

[fireflybob]

At least CVT has a runway which is usually into wind!!

[almost professional]

perhaps someone could give some thought to how these extra IFR airways departures/arrivals would be integrated into the'SAPCO Triangle'-this bit of airspace is creaking already, and I can just see a low cost B737 mixing it in bandit country north of DTY descending for the CT-it will only take one close call!

[Fly_146]

Illustrations of the proposed terminal can be found Here (http://www.coventry-airport.co.uk/terminal.html)

[U/S President]

BoeingMEL: Isn’t there a place called BHX just 18 miles away
Low-cost airlines don’t start operations out of secondary airports because they’re miles away from the competing primary airports – they usually just are. If there’s a cheap secondary airport that’s is actually quite close to where the pax want to go then all the better I guess.
Hamrah: but with Stansted 25 miles away
25 miles away? 117 miles away? You decide.

[redsnail]

New terminal is to be built on the southern side.
Taxi ways can and do take 737's and the like. (Albeit not every 5 minutes). During the day the field is pretty quiet except for light training aircraft, at night it's very busy with freighters of various size coming and going.

[MANTHRUST]

What a good idea to have the runway on the roof of the terminal.
But it does leave the residents of Rugby still without an airport in the 21`st century.

[Capt.Pugwash]

The Third Man,
You are one third short of the truth. Numbers 2 & 3 are correct.

[StressFree]

I've used CVT quite a lot over the years, always found it very easy. I've taken a 737 in there with no trouble................

:cool:

[BEagle]

But isn't Wolverpennyhamptongreen Intergalactic Spaceport playing at being the next alternative to Berrmigoom?

[preston]

hi all

We should hear the outcome of the new terminal shortly.

If it gets the go ahead we will just have to wait and see how busy we get at CVT and see what happens.

:D

the airport website has the plans for the terminal.

[unwiseowl]

What about Cosford? It has it's own motorway junction, a railway station and no anti-noise campaigners.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

Well Cosford would just be too obvious. What with its excellent road and rail connection, its ample space, lack of congestion and proximity to the nations second largest and second wealthiest conurbation. No no no, that won't do at all. Much better to spout rubbish about demolishing Norman-era villages in Rugby and perhaps knock up a passenger shed at Coventry.

Planning? What planning?

Cheers

WWW

[niknak]

I hope it happens, at the moment it's a slightly better bet than the new airport at Rugby being built. :rolleyes:

But where would the funding for all the improvements and new buildings etc come from?
Anyone can draw pretty pictures of terminal buildings and waffle on about low cost carriers, but if theres one thing the Air Alantique Group are well known for, its having short arms and deep pockets when it comes to dishing out cash for anything.

[Dick Fisher]

As a great fan of travelling from my local airports, rather than one in the South Esat of England, I welcome any improvement to Coventry. It can be low cost - although the FlyBe approach also seems a strong alternative - provided they are able to take me where I want to go.

From memory, Cosford must be limited as a viable option. Isn't there an elevated railway line at one end of the runway and a trunk road at the other? Also, having never handled any kind of civilian traffic, I would predict the need for a massive investment in the basic infrastructure before any commercial activities could start.

And as for Halfpenny Green. Not even worth discussing.

[JW411]

Wee Weasley Welshman:

It's a while since I last flew from Cosford but I seem to remember that the runway is just a tad over 1100 metres long and it is hard to see just how you could make it any longer.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

3891ft runway. Yes, thats the snag for sure.

There is a recent study online done into the viability of Cosford for commercial ops. It gives it the thumbs down (conclusions below):

http://www.advantagewm.co.uk/West%20Midlands%20Airport%20Feasibility%20Study%20Final%20Re port.doc



4.1 In our opinion on the basis of the work we have done on this study a market exists in the west of the region for limited air services to UK destinations and near Europe using “Commuter” type quiet twin engined turbo prop aircraft typically seating 40 to 50 passengers.

4.2 Developing RAF Cosford for commercial air services is not an option at the current time.

4.3 Wolverhampton Business Airport is subject to a number of constraints and at present cannot satisfy current identified demand.

Cheers

WWW

[Ian Farquharson]

I heard this remour last week

Where are Lunn Poly based ?

Answer - Coventry

[Buster the Bear]

Surrounded, and 3 years too late.

MTL & RYR Etc at Brum.
EZY and Baby at East Midlands.
EZY, RYR etc at Luton.

How to waste money, launch a new lo-co from CVT. The runway length precludes a lot of destinations.

TUI need thier heads examining!

[Buster the Bear]

Monday September 15, 05:34 PM

TUI to enter UK low-cost airline business

FRANKFURT (Reuters) - Europe's largest travel firm TUI (Xetra: 695200.DE - news) has said it is expanding its airline business in Britain by adding low-cost flights to its current charter business.


The company said it would use its Britannia charter airline as the basis for expansion, which would include classic point-to-point flights from Britain to holiday destinations from the summer of 2004.


The company said it would add two planes to its British business from the summer of 2004.

[rentaghost]

Ah Buster... think a little further...

Who's TUI's favourite UK competitor that still just about has a share price, and runs a lo-co from BHX?

Nothing like kicking someone when they're down!!!

The 'gen' is good, believe me!

[FLYMATE]

Buster the bear, I operated the LTN_BFS on the B757 so your statement saying the 737-200 went so the BFS route went is not valid. As for CVT as lo-cost for Britannia, well good luck to them...LTN is now full and Britannia never supported it's home base very much as we see orange and yellow all over the place now and not Britannia blue...

[Fly_146]

I understand BY have been fed up of the BHX folk for a long while...

[52 North]

CVT's runway is just 1825M, I would have thought even if BY were fed up of BHX they couldn't operate most of their charter flights out of there. There is scope for about 200M more before they have to cross a public road.

The proposed terminal has capacity for just 2 B737-3 loads so it will be probably be too small for BY Express the day it is built, just look at how quick the other low-cost operators have expanded. Also, the planning decision for the terminal is yet to be made, it will be a game getting it ready for a S04 start.

We have seen airlines promising to use CVT before, the operator goes a long way down the road to moving to CVT only to use it as a bargaining tool for better rates at big brother up the road. It may be good gen that BY Express are interested in CVT but they would say that, wouldn't they.

If the (larger) terminal was already built, if they already had a longer runway, if they had already replaced their CAT 1 ILS, I would have given it a better chance, especially as the airport has some of the best road connections in the country (why Parcelforce chose it for their main UK hub). It is definitely a regional airport waiting to happen, it just needs a few million spent on it first.

[Buster the Bear]

The 757 may well have filled in on the LTN-BFS route, loads justified the aircraft around bank holidays I can remember a 767 being used, but once the trooping contract went, so did this route. The 737's were sold off around this time.

Rentaghost from what you are saying, TUI would use CVT just to spite MTL! No Lo-Co makes a profit initially, so it is a loss leader to rattle MyTravel, just does not make economic sense?

Next you will be telling me that Ryanair will be flying from Bruntingthorpe to rattle the Baby!

Luton full............NO WAY. Plenty of capacity, mind you when Now start, easyJet expand further, Volare begin and grow etc?

With a catchment area like Luton's, capacity restrictions at LGW & STN, airlines must be forming a queue outside TBI's marketing department door!

[GK430]

Fly_146

Perhaps you would care to share your "understanding" with the rest of us?

[Best Western]

Don't forget that Ryanair operated into CVT many moons ago

[preston]

i agree we probably do need that bit spent here.

but if the go ahead is given for the terminal things at CVT would develop on a rapid scale.

:)

[Frankfurt_Cowboy]

I've just spent a couple days down in Rugby and saw "Fight the Blight-Say no to the airport" signs everywhere, what are these relating to then? Coventry? Cosford? East Midlands? Cape Walsall?

[52 North]

The Fight - The - Blight banners are to do with the proposed new International Airport near Rugby. This is part of the governments White Paper on Air Transport in the Future. The decision on that should be forthcoming soon but latest rumours suggest it is probably a no go, as Stansted is likely to get at least one more runway (don't know that for sure - but it is a rumour). From what I can can remember, Rugby was only going to get the go ahead if there was no increased runway capacity in the South East.

There is some local resistance to the development of Coventry, a few signs around the airport and plenty in the local press, let me guess, all these folks drive to Cornwall for their holidays.

[G fiend]

I wonder what the thread starter has to say?

As far as I remember, BY did do BFS on the 75 (& 76's at Xmas and Easter). BY made a strategic decision to get rid of all our scheduled services (don't forget BY did MAN-LPA/TFS/PMI and LGW-TFS/PMI as well after the 737-200's were retired. The retirement of the 737-200 was also the reason the MOD flights went elsewhere- the MOD wanted a frequent service, but not the amount of seats.

By the way BY's LTN-BFS was the first lo-cost, no-frills sched service (as I recall 35 quid 1-way, 44 return) and we filled the aeroplanes.

I wonder what aeroplanes are goint to be added to the fleet?

[virginblue]

The rumour is 2 Boeing 737-800s.

[G fiend]

Ahhh! spares from HLF then (I am given to understand that HLF have a couple of aircraft over their programme requirement)

[Buster the Bear]

Charter airline to join budget wars

THE battle of the budget airlines will reach a new high when Britannia Airways launches cheap flights from Luton.

Britain’s biggest charter airline is trying to fight back against the onslaught of Ryanair and EasyJet by setting up its own low-fares operation.

From next summer the battle of the skies will hot up when Britannia will offer cut-price flights to several European destinations.

The airline, which has its headquarters in Luton, has decided to jump on the budget flight bandwagon after experiencing a slump in package holiday sales.
As from next year it will offer ‘seat-only’ fares to holiday hot spots like Portugal, Spain, Cyprus, Corfu, Malta and Italy.

Britannia hopes that by giving passengers the chance to book one-way tickets without having to buy a holiday or return a week or two later will increase sales.

In recent years charter airlines have been fighting a losing battle with no frills flights offered by the likes of Ryanair and EasyJet.

In recent years the number of chartered airline flights has fallen from about one third of the British aviation market to only a fifth.

Britannia spokesman Russell Ison said: “Britannia is planning an extension of its existing seat-only business as a strategic response to strong growth in the low-cost carrier market.

“The additional capacity will be used exclusively for seat-only to predominantly leisure destinations.”