Airlines, Airports, Routes - and climate change
Thread Starter
My real beef is the flying of the F1 cars around, along with the drivers and hangers on.
The real CO2 culprits are actually the fans according to this article.
https://thevarsity.ca/2023/10/01/for...very%20season.
If people travelling to watch a race would/could use greener transport it would have a much bigger effect than the race cars or the air transport could ever have.
This is my point. Air transport is not the problem, surface transport is a much bigger polluter.
https://thevarsity.ca/2023/10/01/for...very%20season.
If people travelling to watch a race would/could use greener transport it would have a much bigger effect than the race cars or the air transport could ever have.
This is my point. Air transport is not the problem, surface transport is a much bigger polluter.
Thread Starter
The real CO2 culprits are actually the fans according to this article.
https://thevarsity.ca/2023/10/01/for...very%20season.
If people travelling to watch a race would/could use greener transport it would have a much bigger effect than the race cars or the air transport could ever have.
This is my point. Air transport is not the problem, surface transport is a much bigger polluter.
https://thevarsity.ca/2023/10/01/for...very%20season.
If people travelling to watch a race would/could use greener transport it would have a much bigger effect than the race cars or the air transport could ever have.
This is my point. Air transport is not the problem, surface transport is a much bigger polluter.
For myself although I own a small city car I only drive to the shops for the big weekly shop, otherwise its a combination of foot, plus tram and / or bus. Obviously it helps that I have an OAP bus and tram pass but the principal benefit is my physical fitness while also reducing my carbon footprint.
Conversely the 16 year old up the road is driven to 600m to school every day.
Point is that all sectors, and all people need to buy into consuming less. I really worry, for my grandchildren, that far too many people and businesses have their heads stuck ostrich-like in the sand. Aviation shouldn't be singled out, but equally shouldn't have an opt out.
The thing is, commercial aviation is self policing. Airlines want more fuel efficiency to increase profits and/or keep prices down to remain competitive. The result is manufacturer's strive for better engines and aircraft design innovation. The 787 is a great example, it's claimed to be 20% more efficient than the aircraft it replaced.
The same could be said for surface transport, however, cutting aviation emissions by 20% is only scratching the surface, cutting surface transport emissions by 20% would have a huge effect.
The same could be said for surface transport, however, cutting aviation emissions by 20% is only scratching the surface, cutting surface transport emissions by 20% would have a huge effect.
The thing is, commercial aviation is self policing. Airlines want more fuel efficiency to increase profits and/or keep prices down to remain competitive. The result is manufacturer's strive for better engines and aircraft design innovation. The 787 is a great example, it's claimed to be 20% more efficient than the aircraft it replaced.
From 'Reducing emissions in aviation'
Policy actions and the efforts of industry have led to improvements in fuel efficiency over recent years. For instance, the amount of fuel burned per passenger dropped by 24% between 2005 and 2017. However, these environmental benefits have been outpaced by a sustained growth in air traffic, with passengers in 2017 flying on average 60% further than in 2005.
Paxing All Over The World
I know that the F-1 people and the fuel companies tout the rapid research, and all the big companies have an excuse.
The root of the problem is that humans are programmed to look at the next year, possibly three. Looking at history, seeing the repeating cycles and then projecting forward? Not so much! The politicians know that they do not get elected by promising no disaster in 25/50 years time.
A simple example of sewarage in the Thames river (data edited from Wikipedia)
That is 20 years for a problem that had been building for decades and was on their doorstep. Where are we now?
The root of the problem is that humans are programmed to look at the next year, possibly three. Looking at history, seeing the repeating cycles and then projecting forward? Not so much! The politicians know that they do not get elected by promising no disaster in 25/50 years time.
A simple example of sewarage in the Thames river (data edited from Wikipedia)
The scientist Michael Faraday described the situation in a letter to The Times in July 1855, shocked at the state of the Thames.
The Great Stink was an event in Central London during July and August 1858 in which the hot weather exacerbated the smell of untreated human waste and industrial effluent that was present on the banks of the River Thames. The problem had been mounting for some years, with an ageing and inadequate sewer system that emptied directly into the Thames.
The [Bazalgette] system became operational in 1875
The Great Stink was an event in Central London during July and August 1858 in which the hot weather exacerbated the smell of untreated human waste and industrial effluent that was present on the banks of the River Thames. The problem had been mounting for some years, with an ageing and inadequate sewer system that emptied directly into the Thames.
The [Bazalgette] system became operational in 1875
I recommend this documentary on You Tube which dissects the science behind climate change. It's worth the 80 minutes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYrTvjCYqQ8&t=4s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYrTvjCYqQ8&t=4s
https://skepticalscience.com/climate...old-myths.html
'Fake graphs and daft conspiracy yarns'
https://www.lse.ac.uk/granthaminstit...opaganda-film/
Climate The Movie "the cold truth" debunked
I absolutely grant you that Formula E will have advanced battery technology, but unless there's a way of making synthetic fuels without using up valuable agricultural land its a red herring, or greenwash.
Aviation shouldn't be singled out, but equally shouldn't have an opt out.
Point is that all sectors, and all people need to buy into consuming less.
) - as I said earlier, the single biggest individual contribuion is to eat less meat. If I've remembered the figures correctly, agriculture is responsible for 40% of greenhous gas ommisions, with arable 10% and livestock related 30%.
All those green drivers charging electric cars today, just 1.44% of your charge is coming from wind power today and very little more from solar, so you are not charging on zero carbon fuel. I will not feel guilty about my next long haul flight. Flying domestically when it can be avoided, probably the greenest alternative, I drive a diesel car that does 50mpg plus on trips between Cornwall and London Airports so on the basis of the above statistic I am probably being as green as I can be!!!
And I eat NO meat.
And I eat NO meat.
I have a petrol car although I rarely use it (so rarely in fact that I disconnect the battery to stop it discharging). Keeping the car you have and using other forms of transport where possible is a good idea. But when maintenance is not longer possible, and a car must be replaced, then BEVs are greener than ICE.
Thread Starter
All those green drivers charging electric cars today, just 1.44% of your charge is coming from wind power today and very little more from solar, so you are not charging on zero carbon fuel. I will not feel guilty about my next long haul flight. Flying domestically when it can be avoided, probably the greenest alternative, I drive a diesel car that does 50mpg plus on trips between Cornwall and London Airports so on the basis of the above statistic I am probably being as green as I can be!!!
And I eat NO meat.
And I eat NO meat.
If EVs are being charged overnight, as is sensible given there are cheaper kW/h rates available then if there is wind, and there usually is, much will come from that renewable source. Had I got an EV I could have charged it any day this week using my own generation from solar, or from battery storage. I'm not suggesting for a moment that more than 50% of EV charging is using renewables, but 1.44% appears very low, and rather too precise.
Also please remember that however good your diesel fuel consumption is (ours is too) you and I are both chucking NOX into the atmosphere along with CO2.
I am also a very bad lad, enjoying red meat on a regular basis, though probably not in the quantities I used to.
Where does that statistic come from? Looks to me as though its one for Tim Harford.
If EVs are being charged overnight, as is sensible given there are cheaper kW/h rates available then if there is wind, and there usually is, much will come from that renewable source. Had I got an EV I could have charged it any day this week using my own generation from solar, or from battery storage. I'm not suggesting for a moment that more than 50% of EV charging is using renewables, but 1.44% appears very low, and rather too precise.
Also please remember that however good your diesel fuel consumption is (ours is too) you and I are both chucking NOX into the atmosphere along with CO2.
I am also a very bad lad, enjoying red meat on a regular basis, though probably not in the quantities I used to.
If EVs are being charged overnight, as is sensible given there are cheaper kW/h rates available then if there is wind, and there usually is, much will come from that renewable source. Had I got an EV I could have charged it any day this week using my own generation from solar, or from battery storage. I'm not suggesting for a moment that more than 50% of EV charging is using renewables, but 1.44% appears very low, and rather too precise.
Also please remember that however good your diesel fuel consumption is (ours is too) you and I are both chucking NOX into the atmosphere along with CO2.
I am also a very bad lad, enjoying red meat on a regular basis, though probably not in the quantities I used to.
It depends where you are and time of year. Over the winter months in the UK windpower is often supplying more than 50% of all UK demand, average is about 30%. Right now it's about 4%.
Thread Starter
Thread Starter
Coming back to your post, while wind won't be supplying much this week solar will be doing more of the heavy lifting.
Paxing All Over The World
This is amusing:
The Independent (UK)
Who is going to tell them?
Thousands of Americans are flying to Europe for Taylor Swift – groupies are changing travel forever
The US dollar’s strong value against the euro is set to increase spending on apparel, memorabilia and Eras Tour products
The US dollar’s strong value against the euro is set to increase spending on apparel, memorabilia and Eras Tour products
Thousands of Taylor Swift fans who missed out on her US tour last year or didn't want to buy exorbitantly priced tickets are flying to Europe.
The star will kick off the 18-city Europe leg of her record-setting Eras Tour in Paris on Thursday, and planeloads of Swifties plan to follow in the coming weeks.
The arena where Swift is appearing says Americans bought 20 per cent of the tickets for her four sold-out shows. Stockholm, the tour's next stop, expects about 10,000 concert-goers from the US
The star will kick off the 18-city Europe leg of her record-setting Eras Tour in Paris on Thursday, and planeloads of Swifties plan to follow in the coming weeks.
The arena where Swift is appearing says Americans bought 20 per cent of the tickets for her four sold-out shows. Stockholm, the tour's next stop, expects about 10,000 concert-goers from the US
Join Date: May 2016
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1) How does the Met Gala in NYC benefit the world? All those clothes and effort and human ingenuity ...
2) How does the Formula 1 circuit help us? How much fuel do they use going round in circles and then (sometimes) flying the cars across the world to do it again? I can see that a few men collect 'fame' and money' but ...
2) How does the Formula 1 circuit help us? How much fuel do they use going round in circles and then (sometimes) flying the cars across the world to do it again? I can see that a few men collect 'fame' and money' but ...
Paxing All Over The World
No Vokes55. I do NOT suggest they are banned - as that will be impossible. I can see why people enjoy all those things. I understand why people cross continents to watch their sports team play. I do other things and am by no means 'green'. I once travelled long haul for three days just to attend the wedding of someone. Recently, for business, I decided to attend a lecture at first hand and took two internal flights.
The reason I pointed out those items, is that the multifarious activities of humans all have an effect on the climate. There are a million activities that could be selected for that list. Humans have become so clever at exploiting the planet - how do we slow down? The answer is, I suggest, that we won't.
The reason I pointed out those items, is that the multifarious activities of humans all have an effect on the climate. There are a million activities that could be selected for that list. Humans have become so clever at exploiting the planet - how do we slow down? The answer is, I suggest, that we won't.
We have relatives (in the UK) who, aside of their annual 3 week trip to Florida, indulge in numerous European breaks (by air of course) plus the odd Mediterranean cruise. Now that, in my opinion is over the top - made all the more irritating by the fact that although they persist, they really do not seem to appreciate their destinations!