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SOUTHAMPTON

Old 30th Jul 2017, 16:57
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RW20

Said slightly tongue in cheek and agree totally that only airside improvement will accelerate growth, maybe an announcement as suggested in Autumn will bring this forward
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Old 30th Jul 2017, 17:28
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stewyb
I fear the announcement may be very limited,at best runway resurfememt,and possible taxiway 20 installation yes! ,but 450 feet runway extension and much needed stands no.
In addition the landing aids are woefull, especially 02 (what's happended to RNAV LPV approaches mooted some time ago?).The SAR is antiquated and possibly one of the last in regular use at a regional airport.Simply the airport has lagged well behind in development,there is simply no comparison with its neighbour Hurn in investment airside.
Until there are major changes then don't expect big players like easy developing a route structure.
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Old 30th Jul 2017, 18:00
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You are probably right RW20 although wouldn't it be nice to be proved wrong! Converting stands 1-5 to 4 for A320 use is surely not too much to ask
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Old 30th Jul 2017, 18:38
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Stewby
Nothing would give me more pleasure!
However the management track record does not hold good, Investment,improvement or slow decline that's the point. What a great airport it could be,let's wait and see!
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Old 30th Jul 2017, 22:27
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RW20,

I'm not an apologist for SOU management (far from it, I despair at some of the short-term thinking and decision making that has hampered the airport over years, on top of its geographic limitations)

However, can you clarify who you mean by "SOU management"?

As I understand it, back in the days when BAA owned it they showed next to no interest in the place, and many of the decisions that currently hamstring it were made under their ownership.

However, since AGS took over we have seen operations announced by VLM (granted they went bust but not the airport's fault, loads on their ANR-HAM service were constantly improving and becoming halfway decent), Aer Lingus regional, Volotea (who have expanded this year), KLM, BMI regional, Powdair (?), skywork (?????) and now easyJet. Not a bad roster of additional operators for a small regional airport in the space of two years.

They're obviously sweating their assets and squeezing as much revenue out of the place as they can in its current configuration, and while it may not be a spotters paradise it does make business sense. I strongly believe that the performance last year, and even more so this year, will prove that demand is there and provide the catalyst for further growth in the near future. Why wouldn't they get as much out of the current infrastructure as they can before committing funds to expand?

Look at Bournemouth and how much money was ploughed into infrastructure investments there on the basis of speculative growth. Has it worked out for them? I'd say not. How long had it been up for sale for now?

As far as the existing infrastructure at SOU goes, you don't need much else to support expanded operations beyond what's already there.

A third taxiway- nice but not a necessity, the runway isn't at capacity and while backtracking isn't normal in this country, it's not an operational issue.
A 20 starter strip- arguably the best chance of a return on investment, this would allow extra performance and new, further destinations, increasing passsenger numbers.
New radar- will probably happen in time but the existing one still works, doesn't it?
New A320 stands- another good idea operationally, would allow more A320 movements at one time so would increase revenue. Not essential though, 320s can still be parked on the existing layout, just not as efficiently.
New approach aids- while they may not be up to scratch compared with bigger airports, how often do flights actually have to divert because of being unable to make an approach? A very small number of flights per year I'd say. These are mostly due to fog, and even a cat III ILS would have times where landings weren't possible. Worth the money? I'd argue not. Aircraft can fly approaches and land on both runways pretty much every day of the year at the moment.
New lighting- see above.

The ability already exists to land, turn round and depart an Airbus-sized aircraft to a sunnier clime, look at Volotea this year, Evelop! last summer or easyJet this coming winter. Expand those existing flights to arrive from and depart to few more destinations, spread them throughout the day/week and hey presto, you've got a reasonably large easyJet operation. Whether it happens or not is another question, but I don't see any reason why it can't.
At least there's some momentum now, how many years was that lacking for?
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Old 30th Jul 2017, 23:08
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A very excellent summary and a good read.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 06:56
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One pertinent question surely is would a starter extension result in the CAA allowing SOU to declare a greater TODA than the current 1,831m? SOU's runway would still be Code 3 which stipulates a TODA of no more than 1,800m. 'Grandfather rights' have allowed the 1,831m to remain up to now but I doubt anything beyond that would be granted.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 07:28
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Expressflight

If the runway is modified, ie a northern extension, due to its width it will stay a Code 3 runway which will dictate a maximum TODA 1799. Cannot imagine that CAA will permit continuance of the present inherited TODA.

One spin off from a northern runway extension would be an improved obstacle environment after departure on RWY 20, and the possibility that the offset Type A Chart could be used by a greater number of aircraft. When I last looked at this problem, when the E145s arrived, obstacles (ie trees) in Marhill Copse were too close to the end of the runway to permit a turn to be made to take advantage of the improvements to be gained by using the offset Type A chart.

A TODA of 1799 works for EZY at SEN, and SOU already has better LDAs than SEN. That only leaves finding somewhere to park two or three A320s and a E195!
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 07:33
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New A320 stands- another good idea operationally, would allow more A320 movements at one time so would increase revenue. Not essential though, 320s can still be parked on the existing layout, just not as efficiently.
Just a simple question from an outsider. I suspect that you are talking about more than just repainting a few white lines and that more concrete is needed for more airbuses? I have watched new stands being created at Luton and to be honest it wasn't a big job. Just lots of cement mixers after scraping the soil away and adding base material.

Last edited by LTNman; 31st Jul 2017 at 07:46.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 07:38
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LTNman

The space is there to reduce from five narrow Stands to four that could take A320s. Just a case of re-painting and moving the Stand Number boards.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 07:59
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Luton has some dual width stands marked left and right for total flexibility. For instance their North Apron can park 4 aircraft but using L and R has 7 stands marked. If this is all that is required surely it would be done when required so is not a big deal.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 16:26
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I agree that there is space to reduce to 4 stands,but wouldn't that impact on an already crowded apron in busy times?I can't agree with what Nutts Mutts suggests,that 'Expand those existing flights to arrive from and depart to few more destinations, spread them throughout the day/week and hey presto, you've got a reasonably large easyJet operation.'If Easy were to develop at Southampton then surely they would require prime time slots when the airport already has a full apron!.
Only stand building ,(and I'm not sure where in the airport structure they could go ) is the realistic option.
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Old 31st Jul 2017, 23:25
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Surely if Easy were to develop at SOU, it will be from bases abroad,like the GVA flight. They already have a summer base at PMI, so that is one real possibility. It avoids peak times at both ends of the route.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 21:32
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Originally Posted by inOban
Surely if Easy were to develop at SOU, it will be from bases abroad,like the GVA flight. They already have a summer base at PMI, so that is one real possibility. It avoids peak times at both ends of the route.
I was thinking the same thing, it would be good to see EZY operating from PMI, I was even thinking that they could operate PMI-SOU-ALC-SOU-PMI with PMI based aircraft in the summer season maybe twice weekly.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 21:49
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AVGeek1

Surely there's already capacity on PMI with Volotea and Flybe operations,what would be a step forward would be Poland, Croatia or Greek islands like Corfu to be offered by Easy.
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Old 13th Aug 2017, 05:47
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I think CFU and DBV would be payload restricted out of SOU

SOU is usually OK for any IT flight up to about 2 hours such as IBZ BCN PMI VCE - over that we start to see restrictions with A320/321 or 738 737max i am pretty sure
that makes the operation costly

although saying that BACF lift EMB190 out of LCY to mykonos skiathos and Santorini
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Old 13th Aug 2017, 13:30
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Originally Posted by RW20
AVGeek1

Surely there's already capacity on PMI with Volotea and Flybe operations,what would be a step forward would be Poland, Croatia or Greek islands like Corfu to be offered by Easy.
But easyJet do not have any bases in Croatia, Poland or Greek Islands, so to serve these EZY would have to set up base operations in Southampton which is very unlikely at the moment, which is why serving Southampton from their European bases is more likely.

I agree that 2 airlines on PMI is adequate for SOU, but it creates competition and means the passengers can have a choice of more frequencies and cheaper air fares. Also, Flybe are very uncertain and have stated their intentions of inkeeping as a 'regional' UK airline and phasing out E195 aircraft.
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Old 13th Aug 2017, 20:26
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Does anyone with inside knowledge know when the expansion plans will be announced? I know it was slated for sometime in Autumn. I noticed they have been hiring for project managers recently.
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Old 19th Aug 2017, 19:20
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CAA July Stats

218,755 passengers were handled in July, up 6% on last year. Good to see the fairly strong growth continuing.

Alicante - 109 pax / 92%
Bastia - 55 pax / 71%
Cork - 54 pax / 76%
Dusseldorf - 53 pax / 68%
East Midlands - 17 pax / 22%
Exeter - 18 pax / 23%
Faro - 107 pax / 91%
Ibiza - 114 pax / 91% (Loads based on all 717?)
Lyon - 61 pax / 78%
Malaga - 107 pax / 91%
Munich - 27 pax / 54% (As previously it is calculated based on all flights being E145's)
Paris CDG - 63 pax / 80%
Perpignan - 66 pax / 84%
Rodez - 17 pax / 34% (still pretty poor even considering Eastern's fares)
Verona - 67 pax / 86%

Data from here: https://www.caa.co.uk/Data-and-analy...-data-2017-07/
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Old 19th Aug 2017, 22:02
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That was a full month of Rodez flights!?
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