PPRuNe Forums

Go Back   PPRuNe Forums > Misc. Forums > Airlines, Airports & Routes
Forgotten your Username/Password?
PPRuNe Email Register FAQ Calendar Advertise Mark Forums Read

Airlines, Airports & Routes Topics about airports, routes and airline business.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 6th July 2008, 02:50   #1 (permalink)
Paxing All Over The World
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hertfordshire, UK.
Posts: 4,097
Air France eyes move to railways

Air France is holding talks on a joint venture that could lead to it offering high-speed rail travel.

The airline confirmed reports it was discussing a possible tie-up with Veolia, a French utility firm that also runs several rail services.

Commentators suggest such a deal would enable the airline to cut fuel costs by moving some services onto the railways. Under the plans Veolia would run trains from Air France's hub airport in Paris to other European destinations.

Rest of story on BBC BBC NEWS | Business | Air France eyes move to railways
Friday, 4 July 2008 11:21 UK
PAXboy is offline   Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 11:02   #2 (permalink)
Just Browsing
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 39
Railway services can be subsidised by governments (unlike airlines) so subsidised services competing with foreign airlines is a good idea - if you're Air France. Seats were subsidised on the TGV service from Paris to Marseille a few years ago. According to a French news website at the time, the Government said it was a move designed to compete with lo-cost airlines - of which there was one, and it wasn't French.

JB

Just Browsing is offline  
Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 11:36   #3 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 169
Not an unusual concept, the virgin group have been down this road for some time now.
codpiece face is offline   Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 11:40   #4 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Leicester
Posts: 48
If you look on Amadeus (and other GDS's), a number of AF flights start or finish on the train already. For example, a flight from Philadelphia to Brussells via JFK and Paris will use two railway journeys that carry AF flight codes.

A good idea because you don't have to wait ages in, or change, terminals in many cases.

It also protects valuable slots at the major hubs. If we could finally get our main lines sorted out (and rail fares!), why not have MAN or LBA to LHR as a rail service.
Code 100 is offline   Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 11:47   #5 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 675
Have Germany not been doing this for a while? In Holland you can buy a train ticket to Schiphol in combination with a KLM ticket. I do not know if that applies to all carriers out of AMS. If so, that might lead to an interesting case of some form of nationalistic discrimination. Why not the same deal for all?
RAT 5 is offline   Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 12:02   #6 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Hyeres, France
Posts: 81
It's a pretty good idea, you know.....And AF ( and LH ! ) have been offering through tickets using rail services for quite a while now....With AF, this includes cities such as Tours, Brussels, etc and others where there is an existing TGV line but no air service....With LH, I believe that these are between Frankfurt and cities such as Stuttgart and Cologne where the journey time is very simlar by rail or by air...

In the land of wine and cheese,although the rail network is not perfect, it is streets ahead of most other European countries because it's still owned by the state....And as mentioned above, investments / subsidies / etc to improve rail networks are permitted by Brussels ( even encouraged ) so a little French tete-a-tete over a nice lunch and I'm sure that the French government will help AF by developing an infrastructure which would suit them both - one asset, two markets - and provide yet more competition for those annoying British and Irish newcomers to domestic air services here....

On the other hand, state ownership means that rail services are one of the main players in the French national sport - going on strike !! So the risk to AF if they do get into bed with SNCF or whoever will be reliability of services....Not really good PR if the service is even slightly unreliable....

But after all, why duplicate the effort and cost of moving people from and to CDG from cities such as Strasburg, Lyon, Bordeaux, etc, when the time for the journies by air and by rail are so similar...And with a TGV station already at CDG2 and no need even to leave the terminals to reach it, there is tremendous potential for cost savings for all involved, not to mention the environmental goodwill that this would be seen to generate....

And question - does a through ticket for an air / rail journey become cheaper if there is no ' ticket tax ' for the part of the journey made by rail ?

So not a new idea, but interesting to see if this will become a full blown operation to destinations outside of France - London using joint services with Eurostar, perhaps, would seem eminently sensible and practical for pax and also free up slots at Heathrow for yet more SkyTeam codeshares....
Hussar 54 is offline   Reply
Old 6th July 2008, 16:54   #7 (permalink)

Rebel PPRuNer
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Toronto, Canada (formerly EICK)
Age: 35
Posts: 2,706
AF + Veolia?

SNCF unions won't like that at all... strike in 5,4,3,2...
MarkD is offline   Reply
Old 7th July 2008, 13:27   #8 (permalink)
Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: 230 DCS (original location) 4.0
Age: 51
Posts: 357
From this site, look under UK codes

Welcome to World Airport Codes


United KingdomBritish Rail TerminalGB493ZLX
United Kingdom
Comore Row Bus StnGB493ZBC
United KingdomLondon St. PancrasGB493QQS
United KingdomLondon-WaterlooGB493QQW
United KingdomRailway StationGB493XQIUnited KingdomRailway StationGB493XQHUnited KingdomRailway StationGB493XWS
United KingdomScotRailGB493ZDUUnited KingdomScotRailGB493ZGGUnited KingdomScotRailGB493ZIV
United KingdomVictoria Railway Stn.GB493ZEP

United KingdomBus StationGB493ZFCUnited KingdomBus StationGB493ZEQ

Sadly the formating went astray but you can get the idea
Nowt new really

or historically the other way round
Railway Air Services - RAS
west lakes is offline   Reply
Old 7th July 2008, 14:38   #9 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Age: 80
Posts: 28
Quote:
United Kingdom
Comore Row Bus StnGB493ZBC
No criticism of you at all WL , (this is aimed at the website mentioned)but:
There's no such thing as this so called bus station . Admittedly there is a line of bus stops on Colmore Row Birmingham, but to call it a bus staion is frankly laughable. I'm gobsmacked that they should call it thus! Who supplied the information for this section of the website? The Cousins? I wonder just how many other places are as misrepresented as this is.
groundedforgood is offline   Reply
Old 7th July 2008, 14:44   #10 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Amman Jordan
Posts: 222
We have Virgin Railways and Virgin Atlantic - admittedly different Companies, but maybe one day we will see a Pendalino or Voyager at Heathrow ready to take Pax to the Midlands, North West and Scotland and back. Perhaps E ticketing would be available for both plane and train journey on one booking.

National Express - thats another story!!!
crewmeal is offline   Reply
Old 7th July 2008, 15:43   #11 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: between a rock and a hard place
Posts: 46
well veolia all ready operate near me..........they empty our bins!!!!
scrivenger is offline   Reply
Old 7th July 2008, 15:58   #12 (permalink)
INKJET
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: gate 67 JFK
Posts: 178
The key is in intergrated transport policy as expoused the fomer DPM John Prescott, sadly other than eating (then barffing up meat pies) he did sod all.

Manchester and Birmingham have good rail links, but where its needed is LHR & LGW (Southampton is ok too) if LHR had a mainline in from the North then the like of bmi services to LBA & MME would be dead, very few people use these routes if going city to city.

If i were running LHR and pushing for a new runway i would push very hard for a mainline rail service into LHR and not just a branch line

INKJET is offline  
Reply
Old 8th July 2008, 16:53   #13 (permalink)

Rebel PPRuNer
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Toronto, Canada (formerly EICK)
Age: 35
Posts: 2,706
YYZ-YXU or even YGK would be a candidate for a similar type of operation rather than 7-10x puddlejumper but we don't have those kind of b@lls in Ontario.
MarkD is offline   Reply
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes


Posting Rules
vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
British Railways. G-CPTN Jet Blast 29 26th July 2007 01:28
Britain's Micky Mouse Railways IB4138 Jet Blast 20 15th January 2006 07:33
Railways and overhead power. tony draper Jet Blast 56 29th June 2005 09:57
Railways and Transport Safety Act 2003 vintage ATCO ATC Issues 3 14th January 2004 04:33
Airways not Railways MaxMet Cabin Crew 3 3rd August 2003 21:45


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:37.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC7
© 1996-2008 The Professional Pilots Rumour Network

As these are anonymous forums the origins of the contributions may be opposite to what may be apparent. In fact the press may use it, or the unscrupulous, or sciolists*, to elicit certain reactions.

*"sciolist"... Noun, archaic. "a person who pretends to be knowledgeable and well informed".